old DRGM lever padlock found in Switzerland

[femurat]

I was given this padlock by a friendly Swiss Lady who knows I'm interest in locks. From what I've understood, she found it in a place where you can bring your old furnitures and let them for free to who may need them.
Looking for DRGM gave me just Deutsches Reich Gebrauchsmuster (German Reich Registered Design). I'd be curious to find out more about this old padlock, so if you think you know something more about it you're welcome.

It's clearly a lever lock, you can see some levers in the close up of the keyhole. As soon as she gave it to me, I've tried to pick it with a bent hair-clip while pulling the shackle, but I had the impression that pulling the shackle doesn't tension the levers. I may need to make a tool to pick it, but I'll try with a couple of bent wires before. Any suggestions?

Cheers

[gloves]

It's clearly a lever lock, you can see some levers in the close up of the keyhole. As soon as she gave it to me, I've tried to pick it with a bent hair-clip while pulling the shackle, but I had the impression that pulling the shackle doesn't tension the levers. I may need to make a tool to pick it, but I'll try with a couple of bent wires before. Any suggestions?

Cheers

You probably better clean and lubricate it nicely then use a stronger wire than a hairclip. Not that clips don't work, just that they don't perform as good in less than ideal conditions.

[femurat]

Hi gloves, I've cleaned the lock with some Svitol (it's similar to WD40). Then tried to push the levers with a strong wire. I can lift them but I don't feel them binding, even if I pull the shackle very strongly.
Due to the keyhole warding it's difficult to fit 2 wires. I'll try to find an old key that fits and transform it in a tension wrench.

Also, I'd like to make a key for this old padlock...

Cheers

[Lauren]

This appears to be a transitional smoke house padlock, or the design borrows features found in this era. The key hole style is found in some older smoke house locks. The trick to opening this lock is most likely to find or make a key that passes through the warding. There may be some additional internal locking features that prevent all fitted keys from opening the lock, but I sort of doubt it, and I wouldn't no without doing some probing first. The unique shape of the key hole in its self is a ward, and is probably the main locking feature! "Security by obscurity", as it has been said many times in this forum. You may have a lock that is rusted out internally and any attempt to open it may damage it. This is something that I was just reminded of by some work I currently doing for one of my clients. His lock had complete internal rusting, and the only thing holding the hasp in the locked position was some small remains of the locking bolt. The hasp, while in the locked position, was holding internal parts together.

A key for this double sided warded lock could be machined from cold steel. I've made keys like this, but on a smaller scale for double bit 6 & 8 lever padlocks. The process would be the same, only I would have to use a larger cut off wheel. I would machine a barrel key with a block of metal on end that would in compass the width of the key. Once this is done, I would raise my drill press table to the correct height with the cut off wheel and arbor adapter locked in the drill chuck. The height is important because as the work piece is pressed against the edge of the cut off wheel and flipped (this is done on both sides of the key block totaling 4 cuts), the remaining material needs to be the correct bit thickness need to pass through the key hole. I would have to be extremely careful not to cut to deep into the block of the key, because I might enter in to the shaft geometry. The side wards of the key would be made last. This could be done by locking the key into a slide vise while using the cut off wheel again. The drill press table would have to be adjusted accurately to maintain the correct ward positioning.

I hope this makes sense. The process of making double bit keys is pretty much the same a making single sided barrel keys- a process which I have shown with pictures earlier in the pages of this thread.

Good question, and thank you.

[femurat]

Lauren, your description does make sense! Unfortunately I don't have a drill press... but I'll keep your instructions with me when I visit a friend of mine with some nice metal working tools.

Thanks

[Lauren]

I see after reading your thread, (I should have scrolled the entire page-I'm sorry) that your lock has levers inside. Ok, the levers need to be depressed all the way if they contact the hasp directly. Sometimes hasp shims can be used to hold a lever in position while you attack the remaining levers. If the lever stack doesn't contact the hasp directly, then there has to be more complex gate,fence and lever interaction which makes picking the lock more difficult. Your first goal needs to be getting the lock open before making a key. This will aid you in correctly cutting the depths on the key bits. Let me know if and when you accomplish this.

[femurat]

Great, thanks. I'll let you know when I open it

[femurat]

I found an old key and filed down its width, enlarged its hole and reduced its thickness. The key was my wrench. I dig out an old L wire I bent years ago to pick a lever lock and was able to pick this antique padlock. I'm so happy...

Cheers

[femurat]

Some thoughts about this padlock: The filed down key goes in in the left part of the keyhole and it's rotated CW. The pick goes in the right part of the keyhole and it's used to push up the levers. I think that with the proper key the right part of the keyhole is never used: the key is inserted in the left side, rotated a little more than 90 degrees and the shackle is free. Then the shackle is pulled out and the key rotated back and extracted.

From what I can see and feel, there are 4 levers over the latch. In the free shackle hole I can see a thin plate that separates the latch and the levers.

Next step is try to make a key...

Cheers

[raimundo]

good close up of the keyway, by now you know how many of those layers are levers and if any of them is a ward that looks like a lever, You may be able to impression a rough key that will contain the information that you would need to make a barrel key with a sheet of flat brass, that is bent to go around one side of the post.

Good work opening it, you must have felt good when that popped

Femurat does it again.

[femurat]

Hi Ray, yes, I was excited when I opened it the first time. It was a good sensation

I've carefully studied the levers, the first and the last one are somewhat connected to the latch and are both usable to apply tension. These 2 levers are separated by thin sheets of metal from the 3 central levers. Yes, this padlock has just 3 levers. So the key blade should roughly look like this |'''| where the 3 apostrophes have different heights, the key bittings.

I've tried to impression a rough key but noticed that now that it has been picked, the levers are somewhat stuck in their position and I can pick the lock with just the wrench I made. I just need to push alternatively the first and last levers, without touching the 3 central ones, and the latch is retracted.
I may have played too much with it, being it rusted and fragile. In fact I see a small piece of metal coming down in the right part of the keyway
I'd better leave this padlock alone to avoid breaking it. All in all it was a fun experience.

Cheers