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American Combination Lock with Key Override

Information about locks themselves. Questions, tips and lock diagram information should be posted here.

Moderators: zeke79, keysman

American Combination Lock with Key Override

Postby mr_gray » Wed Apr 14, 2010 9:24 pm

So i'm still very new to lockpicking, but I've come across an older American combination lock stashed in my glove box like the attached picture but with a blue face. Note the key override on the back. That's what I'm interested in, not the combination. Based on the shape of the window on the back, the plug looks to turn clockwise. Also, I think there are only 3 pins, but there are times I could swear I heard 4 resetting. Does anyone have info on the pins that could help out a newbie? Thanks.
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Re: American Combination Lock with Key Override

Postby unlisted » Wed Apr 14, 2010 10:57 pm

Combo locks are considered advanced, more so since this has a over-ride (school) feature.

(I will say this, treat it like a really small lock) ;) Sorry I cannot be more help.
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Re: American Combination Lock with Key Override

Postby Josh K » Thu Apr 15, 2010 10:42 am

unlisted wrote:Combo locks are considered advanced, more so since this has a over-ride (school) feature.

(I will say this, treat it like a really small lock) ;) Sorry I cannot be more help.


Wait, you're saying beer / pop can shims doen't exist? :shock: Meddlesome children will resort to the practices art of lock picking rather then the destruction of their favorite beverage container? :shock: :shock:

:D
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Re: American Combination Lock with Key Override

Postby nothumbs » Sat Apr 17, 2010 4:17 am

http://www.americanlock.com/A-001.pdf

Appears to be a 4 pin lock. Public info.
It's a good day when I learn something new.
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Re: American Combination Lock with Key Override

Postby unlisted » Sat Apr 17, 2010 6:02 am

nothumbs wrote:http://www.americanlock.com/A-001.pdf

Appears to be a 4 pin lock. Public info.


Yes, it is, but we are not about to help him pick this certain lock, since his IP is returning to a education facility, and this is the type of lock they very well could use on site.

I already told him to treat it as a small lock when picking, what more than that does he need to know?

If he really wants to know more, he can try picking it. :P
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Re: American Combination Lock with Key Override

Postby nothumbs » Sat Apr 17, 2010 7:45 am

I'd like clarity on site policy about links to public info. Perhaps I've missed something but:

1) I've not noticed (perhaps my oversight) any policy against links to public info.

2) I'm not aware we have a pre-existing bias against those with IP addresses that originate from .edu domains. Seems inappropriate to me, but then, if there is a policy, clearly I would support it. This might however, require that all postings from .edu domains be marked as such at time of posting, or so it would seem to me.

3) No offense intended to anyone, but I can't read minds, find it sometimes difficult to infer intent from a posting, and as I believe the main purpose of this community is to share information, I'd like to do so when allowable. Clearly there are times that one might infer intent (the many, 'I picked the lock and now it won't turn back' postings are usually one such, and I clearly understand that any questions about safes are advanced material although I observe that I've occasionally seen some responses in the open areas that include links to public info.

I recognize that life is full of uncertainty, but I've found this community both educational and convivial. I'd like to continue both.
It's a good day when I learn something new.
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Re: American Combination Lock with Key Override

Postby Josh K » Sat Apr 17, 2010 8:24 am

nothumbs wrote:I'd like clarity on site policy about links to public info. Perhaps I've missed something but:

1) I've not noticed (perhaps my oversight) any policy against links to public info.

As far as I am aware there are no exisiting policies against links to public information, however extended discussion on topics deemed advanced is not permitted, regardless of the available public information.

2) I'm not aware we have a pre-existing bias against those with IP addresses that originate from .edu domains. Seems inappropriate to me, but then, if there is a policy, clearly I would support it. This might however, require that all postings from .edu domains be marked as such at time of posting, or so it would seem to me.

If you have someone coming from a University IP address asking how to pick BEST IC locks, with minimal posts and cropped pictures, it's a good bet they they aren't into lock sport and simply are misguided youth looking to exploit something. Be it policies about lockouts (cost) or B&E on dorms and classrooms.

3) No offense intended to anyone, but I can't read minds, find it sometimes difficult to infer intent from a posting, and as I believe the main purpose of this community is to share information, I'd like to do so when allowable. Clearly there are times that one might infer intent (the many, 'I picked the lock and now it won't turn back' postings are usually one such, and I clearly understand that any questions about safes are advanced material although I observe that I've occasionally seen some responses in the open areas that include links to public info.

The main intent it to promote lock sport as a legal, fun, and safe hobby. Sharing information is not frowned upon, but low posts and asking questions about information that really isn't at their level raises flags. We aren't mind readers, but the people that have been around the block once or twice (unlisted, mods, admins, etc) do notice repeating patterns that often indicate someone who isn't in for the hobby.

I recognize that life is full of uncertainty, but I've found this community both educational and convivial. I'd like to continue both.


As mentioned there is activity that raises flags in my minds. Take a look through some of the past posts like people who have "picked" KeyMark, or BEST locks and are asking pointed questions about them. More interestingly is the guy who claimed he has a BEST SFIC in his house and wanted to know if a key could be made without repinning the lock.
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Re: American Combination Lock with Key Override

Postby unlisted » Sat Apr 17, 2010 9:45 am

This is more something that should be addressed in a PM....


From what I have been told, if its a new member, and it is clearly not their lock, or it is a "school function" lock, the post is supposed to be moderated. Personally, I do at times check up on the IP, to assist me in my "decisions". I have a greater "knee jerk" reaction (lock a thread) if the IP returns to a public or high school, versus post secondary, as this one does.

Now, since it is a fine line, I don't (normally) immediately lock it up, I wait to see what the OP response is.

Also- combo locks are advanced. Shall I simply move this into the advanced forums, and not let the OP see what has transpired? I feel until something directly relating to advanced picking/bypassing this lock, it can stay in the public forums. AFAIK, I have not moderated any content posted in this thread, since there has not been anything overly advanced published about it.

And finally- the OP never did post a photo of his own lock, he states the images uploaded are not his- so how are we supposed to know its not attached to a locker? All this, with a school IP, school type combo lock, and being a new member, does raise some flags in my opinion. I'd be less concerned if the images posted show his own lock, not attached to anything. (with the shackle in the unlocked position) If this was a kwikset or a schlage, I am sure the response would be different.

I will also have an admin weigh in on this.. I may of been mis informed when I took this mod job..
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Re: American Combination Lock with Key Override

Postby 98AB49DC5A » Mon Apr 19, 2010 9:51 am

Funny thing, i ran into one of these at my secondary school just 3 weeks ago. Another thing, I spent about half a year figuring out how to open these cheap 3 digit combo locks (dudley's specifically (now takes about 2-3 mins per lock)).

Anyways in this one the keyway seems designed to prevent picking with a paperclip or other common object but it's actually really easy to get the combo through manipulation if you sit down and read safecracking for the computer scientists as well as the how stuff works article youshould eventually get the combo. also if you're going to try all the combo's there's a tolerance of about 2.5 on each number so nearest multiple of 5 should work(as is true with dudley's)

Just wondering where would it be appropriate to post a several page discourse(it may not actually be that much info) on the opening of these types of combo locks through manipulation?(is that advanced stuff?)
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Re: American Combination Lock with Key Override

Postby Josh K » Mon Apr 19, 2010 9:59 am

98AB49DC5A wrote:Funny thing, i ran into one of these at my secondary school just 3 weeks ago. Another thing, I spent about half a year figuring out how to open these cheap 3 digit combo locks (dudley's specifically (now takes about 2-3 mins per lock)).

Anyways in this one the keyway seems designed to prevent picking with a paperclip or other common object but it's actually really easy to get the combo through manipulation if you sit down and read safecracking for the computer scientists as well as the how stuff works article youshould eventually get the combo. also if you're going to try all the combo's there's a tolerance of about 2.5 on each number so nearest multiple of 5 should work(as is true with dudley's)

Just wondering where would it be appropriate to post a several page discourse(it may not actually be that much info) on the opening of these types of combo locks through manipulation?(is that advanced stuff?)


If you're curious to know if something is deemed "advanced" the best way to find out without incurring the wrath of the PTB is to send one of the Mods / Admins a PM. ;)
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Re: American Combination Lock with Key Override

Postby unlisted » Mon Apr 19, 2010 2:58 pm

Combos are advanced.. but the information is easily search-able on google, etc.

We just prefer not to deal with it in the open forums, since its a combo lock, and a common school lock.
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Re: American Combination Lock with Key Override

Postby mr_gray » Fri Apr 23, 2010 12:43 am

I apologize for seeming so shady. For what it's worth at this point (probably not much) I can assure you this lock is my property and isn't attached to anything. I've included pictures of it. Sorry I was too lazy to take pictures before. unlisted, I appreciate you trying to keep this a legitimate forum and checking up on me. Also thanks to nothumbs for the pdf, that was very informative. Honestly I've given up on this lock for the time being as I have some master-locks coming from ebay soon. Again, sorry about the post and I'll be more forthright and legitimate in the future.
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Re: American Combination Lock with Key Override

Postby 98AB49DC5A » Fri Apr 23, 2010 3:38 am

I've got the exact same one(now) recracked the combo which I had forgotten, will post pics
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Re: American Combination Lock with Key Override

Postby nothumbs » Fri Apr 23, 2010 5:08 am

Mr. Gray, thanks for the followup. One more data point towards the notion of not pre-judging folks based on their IP address.
It's a good day when I learn something new.
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Re: American Combination Lock with Key Override

Postby Josh K » Sat Apr 24, 2010 4:57 am

nothumbs wrote:Mr. Gray, thanks for the followup. One more data point towards the notion of not pre-judging folks based on their IP address.


Profiling people is a tried and mostly true system. ;) SFIC BEST deadbolts anyone?
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