Some questions about key codes.

[Viggs]

Key cutting and master keying are not things that I'm very knowledgeable about. So I'd like to run this by you guys to make sure I have the right idea about codes. True or False... All locks have a number of pre-determined key bitting depths (usually 9 or so). So that a 5 pin key could be described by numbers (e.g. 37148). Each of these numbers correspond to bitting depths that are consistent for all locks of the same brand. But different brands have different depths. So a 12345 masterlock key would be different than a 12345 Schlage key. Is that correct?

The reason I ask is that I'd like to make my own bump keys. I ordered an 18 piece bumpkey kit online. But, because they were cut by a machine, the bitting looks like this /-\_/-\_/-\_/-\. I'm convinced, after reading a bit on the subject, that a much better result is produced by hand-filed keys with shark tooth bitting (ie. /\/\/\/\/\). It may be BS, but I want to experiment with it anyway. And in order to do this, I need a code book to tell me what the bottom depth is for each major make of lock.

Soooooo... my question is as follows. Assuming my understanding of lock coding is correct (and I don't know if it is), where can I buy code books? All the suppliers I've come across sell only to credentialed locksmiths.

Thanks!

[datagram]

You're correct, but sawtooth bitting isn't really what you want. You want all pin depths to be the lowest, but you still need cuts to be spaced properly to allow the pins to drop down as far as they can. In addition, you can't make the slopes on the cuts too steep or else you can get the key stuck in the lock (referred to as back-cutting).

dg

[barbarian]

I'm not an expert, but I will try to help a bit.

You are sorta right on the first part, there could be numbers to describe the depths, but most of the time the codes that are in the code books are not pin depths. So you might see a code like 3405CRF. This is not the depths.

If the keys you got are cut properly, you could just deepen the depths with a file and get the result you want.

I think what you really want are depth and spacing charts. This is a breakdown of the spacing of each pin and the length of each pin for a certain lock. So that if you knew a certain lock used a difference of say .160 for each different pin, you could just file your cuts that much deeper to get a depth "A" instead of 9.

Hope this helps a bit.

[keysman]

What you are looking for is " space and depth" information

try here http://web.archive.org/web/20051214031508/http://www.dlaco.com/spacing/spacing.htm


have fun

[Viggs]

What you are looking for is " space and depth" information

try here http://web.archive.org/web/200512140315 ... pacing.htm

Thank you! That's EXACTLY what I was looking for. Here's the thread (from the keypicking forums) that explains the concept I'm interested in for bump keys (LINK). It could be that I just totally suck at bumping and gave up too easily the first time. But I had absolutely zero success at bumping any lock I own. I tried every imaginable variation of turning pressure and tapping force.

I know (as per your signature) how lame it is to blame your tools. But I wonder if there's just too much slop in the bottom of each key bitting so that the force isn't being transferred well. The way this guy describes his bumpkey concept is that the barest of taps will immediately transfer force. Sooo, I wanted to give it a shot.