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mastered locks

European hardware -lever locks, profile cylinders specific for European locks. European lock picks and European locks.

Moderators: zeke79, keysman

mastered locks

Postby antaean3000 » Fri Nov 20, 2009 11:30 pm

Iv seen many locks that say they are mastered and on a video i watched about lock picking they say that its easier to pick some mastered locks because the posibility of so many different cobanations of the pins where there are different mastered keys for the locks.

My question is if you brought a couple of locks of the same brand like master lock or squire locks what are the chances of the same key working in another lock of the same brand and same model?.

Or could you use the key provided to create a bumpkey?

I think the video guide said the bump key would need to be set to all 3's or something. Surely if you took your key for the master lock down to a key cutters and requested for them to cut a key which is set to all 3's they could do that and you could use it to bump the lock?.

Or could you grind down the key to make a bump key.
Would bump keys work on newer low security locks?.

I like the idea of bump keys ever since i saw the first video on bump keys but i dont see any websites that sell master or squire bump keys or jiggler/skeleton keys.

One last question what are fire brigade keys? iv seen them on so many websites but there is very little info on what they are actualy for.
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Re: mastered locks

Postby Rickthepick » Sat Nov 21, 2009 12:00 am

you can make your own bump key by hand filing the cuts in the key all down to the lowest depth.

just make sure to keep your filing straight as veering off the original mark will make it less likely to work.

also file all the peaks of the key down a little to prevent jamming

---

fire brigade keys are used to access common areas, used by the fire brigade to speed up entry to certain areas

theres also the drop key that fits in a round hole and pivots at one end to throw a release switch that opens communal doors in flats and housing blocks
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Re: mastered locks

Postby Wizer » Sat Nov 21, 2009 12:58 am

:)
Master keys :
http://www.lockwiki.com/index.php/Master_key
...and about a key working on two random locks of same kind:
Take your Master 3, there is 4 cuts, each can be cut to 8 different depths, 8 x 8 x 8 x 8 = 4096 different keys minus few ( like 0000, 7777, 0707, etc.)
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Re: mastered locks

Postby thelockpickkid » Sat Nov 21, 2009 1:28 am

Yes it is possible to find a key that will fit someone elses lock and open it. It doesn't happen often. Most companys will distribute the same lock matches to another part of the country or another country all together. I know of a few ford vehicles around here and some chevys that the keys interchange with! For vehicles, I would say more common than you think. For Master Locks and Kwiksets, not so common, but plausible.
Shoot first ask questions later! Thelockpickkid
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Re: mastered locks

Postby Solomon » Sat Nov 21, 2009 3:07 am

antaean3000 wrote:Iv seen many locks that say they are mastered and on a video i watched about lock picking they say that its easier to pick some mastered locks because the posibility of so many different cobanations of the pins where there are different mastered keys for the locks.

Locks rarely have any extra markings to say they're part of a master system... occasionally there is a code stamped on the plug, but most of the time they don't have any markings. This is true though, more shear lines means a higher margin for error, so it can make picking easier. Not always, though.

antaean3000 wrote:My question is if you brought a couple of locks of the same brand like master lock or squire locks what are the chances of the same key working in another lock of the same brand and same model?.

It is possible to come across 2 locks which work wih the same key, since lots of different manufacturers use the same profiles, but the chances are still very slim. The chances of a key working in 2 of the same brand and model of lock are virtually zero.

antaean3000 wrote:Or could you use the key provided to create a bumpkey?

I think the video guide said the bump key would need to be set to all 3's or something. Surely if you took your key for the master lock down to a key cutters and requested for them to cut a key which is set to all 3's they could do that and you could use it to bump the lock?.

Yes, you can take any old key and make a bump key from it. The cuts need to be set to the deepest cut, which is generally 9, but without a code machine you need to look at the lock itself to figure out the correct depth. You can't take a key to some random key cutting place because they don't use code machines; all they can do is duplicate existing keys for you. A locksmith won't cut any kind of bump key for you unless they know you personally and trust you.

antaean3000 wrote:Or could you grind down the key to make a bump key.
Would bump keys work on newer low security locks?.

A basic bump key will open any standard pin tumbler lock providing it has the correct profile, depth and spacing.

antaean3000 wrote:I like the idea of bump keys ever since i saw the first video on bump keys but i dont see any websites that sell master or squire bump keys or jiggler/skeleton keys.

That's probably because masters locks are very easy to pick and there is no need for them. And you're not honestly thinking of bumping that squire luggage lock, are you? :lol:

antaean3000 wrote:One last question what are fire brigade keys? iv seen them on so many websites but there is very little info on what they are actualy for.

Certain buildings will have locks which are mastered in such a way that they can be opened by the emergency services in non-life threatening situations where busting the door down with an axe isn't necessary. These keys are more collectors items than anything else as tryout keys for various lever locks are available and do the same job.
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Re: mastered locks

Postby antaean3000 » Sat Nov 21, 2009 4:23 am

I am just itching to open that darn squire lock and my picks still not here and i just cant wait for them and even then i dont think they will work on the squire lock i brought cheap on ebay.
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Re: mastered locks

Postby Solomon » Sat Nov 21, 2009 6:23 am

antaean3000 wrote:I am just itching to open that darn squire lock and my picks still not here and i just cant wait for them and even then i dont think they will work on the squire lock i brought cheap on ebay.

Course you'll open it, it's an easy lock. The goso picks are a bit on the thick side, but you'll still be able to pick it... and they'll be with you soon, just read up more stuff on locks and watch more videos untiil they arrive. :mrgreen:
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Re: mastered locks

Postby exspook » Sat Nov 21, 2009 3:52 pm

some of the Squire padlocks have a high lift at the tip so getting to that pin can be difficult

the keyways are nice and open so try varying the tension and take it easy (A lighter tension has worked well for me in the past)
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Re: mastered locks

Postby antaean3000 » Sat Nov 21, 2009 9:25 pm

Solomon wrote:
antaean3000 wrote:I am just itching to open that darn squire lock and my picks still not here and i just cant wait for them and even then i dont think they will work on the squire lock i brought cheap on ebay.

Course you'll open it, it's an easy lock. The goso picks are a bit on the thick side, but you'll still be able to pick it... and they'll be with you soon, just read up more stuff on locks and watch more videos untiil they arrive. :mrgreen:


I think they arrived today at 11am but i did not hear the postman so i gotta pick em up monday.

Atleast i can try em out for a few hours on monday and ig ot until monday to learn some more stuff.

I think the squire will be a easy one because its a low security padlock. I do not think the pins are higher on this one.

Since i took a interest in lock picking iv seen so many different locks in my place from window locks to locker locks on the old locker someone left in the garage before we mvoed in to this house
to a one disc type lock.

I got plenty to practise on.
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Re: mastered locks

Postby Rickthepick » Sat Nov 21, 2009 10:06 pm

I got plenty to practise on.


thats what its all about :wink:
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Re: mastered locks

Postby antaean3000 » Mon Nov 23, 2009 7:50 am

Rickthepick wrote:
I got plenty to practise on.


thats what its all about :wink:


True. Hopefully i will have those picks tomorrow.
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Re: mastered locks

Postby Solomon » Mon Nov 23, 2009 8:10 am

antaean3000 wrote:True. Hopefully i will have those picks tomorrow.

I'm sure you'll let us know. You might wanna try and get some wiper inserts to make different tensioners with... the flat ones in the goso set are a bit awkward and the rod-style tensioner is pretty wide so you can't use it for top of keyway tension. It takes up too much space when dealing with smaller padlocks like the ones you have at the moment, so it'd be a wise move.
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Re: mastered locks

Postby antaean3000 » Mon Nov 23, 2009 11:38 pm

Solomon wrote:
antaean3000 wrote:True. Hopefully i will have those picks tomorrow.

I'm sure you'll let us know. You might wanna try and get some wiper inserts to make different tensioners with... the flat ones in the goso set are a bit awkward and the rod-style tensioner is pretty wide so you can't use it for top of keyway tension. It takes up too much space when dealing with smaller padlocks like the ones you have at the moment, so it'd be a wise move.


They never showed up. Not got any emails from ukbumpkeys i called but no one is there.

Its been a week since i ordered and £6 for delivery you would have expected the tools to arrive by now. If sent out by special delivery "for £6 postage it should be by speical deliver" they would have arrived by now.
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Re: mastered locks

Postby Rickthepick » Mon Nov 23, 2009 11:55 pm

ukbumpkeys can be a bit slack when it comes to delivery. claim your money back via paypal if they dont have the courtesy to reply
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Re: mastered locks

Postby antaean3000 » Tue Nov 24, 2009 6:50 am

Rickthepick wrote:ukbumpkeys can be a bit slack when it comes to delivery. claim your money back via paypal if they dont have the courtesy to reply

I have put in a dispute. I just feel pretty angry. I need lock picking tools i only have paypal and now i am out of money because they have my money and did not send the items.

i wish i could remeber who i ordered my bump key from in the past because they had a good serivce they even called me up to confirm my order which was cool.

But if ukbumpkeys dont deliver my goods i wont ever use them again and i plan on buying quiet a few lock picks.
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