manchester locksmith course

[belldinger1]

Hi all im new to the forum, anyway im about to go on the 5 day locksmithing course in atherton as anybody been on it if not which is recommended in the nortwest area

[79commando]

Currently almost all courses taught over a short time appear to specialise in bypassing locks, either by picking or drilling. If it's for a hobby anyone is as good as the next with the exception of one from the North East which is mince.

If it's for a new career move you're a couple of years too late as the market is swamped. Just do a search under the business section to see how little work is out there. Picking locks is about 5% of most locksmiths work now. There's more money in Dog Walking.

[mullen]

Currently almost all courses taught over a short time appear to specialise in bypassing locks, either by picking or drilling. If it's for a hobby anyone is as good as the next with the exception of one from the North East which is mince.

If it's for a new career move you're a couple of years too late as the market is swamped. Just do a search under the business section to see how little work is out there. Picking locks is about 5% of most locksmiths work now. There's more money in Dog Walking.

cant beat a straight answer commando ....top man

[mullen]

Currently almost all courses taught over a short time appear to specialise in bypassing locks, either by picking or drilling. If it's for a hobby anyone is as good as the next with the exception of one from the North East which is mince.

If it's for a new career move you're a couple of years too late as the market is swamped. Just do a search under the business section to see how little work is out there. Picking locks is about 5% of most locksmiths work now. There's more money in Dog Walking.

cant beat a straight answer commando ....top man

not sure what you mean by mince though is that good or bad cos im looking for a course myself

[belldinger1]

fair one, ive looked on jobcentre plus and theres absolutley nothing and within the last year or so the rate of pay for most jobs as gone down to minimum wage, so taking the gamble doing the course might not be a bad thing after all

[Phatphish]

It is worth mentioning that you are unlikely to find work with an existing locksmith, so if you are thinking of starting your own business have a read of this thread viewtopic.php?f=23&t=4708
Start up costs are quite high and decent reccuring advertising can cost an arm and a leg but is essential. As with any business it is worth getting a decent accountant. They can give advice on things you may not have thought about and will find ways to reduce tax payments to a minimum. I tried filing my own returns the first year I was operating, which worked out ok as far as keeping legal with the tax man, but in the second year I decided to get myself an accountant and was suprised at how many things I could have done in my first year which would have saved me even more.
If you are going to start operating as a sole trader, as opposed to a limited company, expect the end of year accounting fee to be around £300-400. This , in my opinion, was great value considering the advice given and costs saved.
Good luck with whatever you decide to go ahead with.

[belldinger1]

yes thanks for advice, ive recently just sold my own small buisness, resturant in windermere (leasehold) which im glad ive sold the overheads were horrendous and i was vat registered which with my own opinion I WILL NOT BE DOING AGAIN if possible, it caused me many money problems, i was paying out more then what was coming in even when you can claim back alot. Is anybody out there had the same problems with vat and think they are better off not registering, or maybe its just the catering industry that suffer.

[Phatphish]

If your turnover of VAT taxable goods and services supplied within the UK for the previous 12 months is more than the current registration threshold of £70,000, or you expect it to go over that figure in the next 30 days alone, you must register for VAT. However, if your turnover has gone over the registration threshold temporarily then you may be able to apply for exception from registration.
It is unlikely that you would exceed this in the first year of business as you wont have a large customer base, so steer clear of doing this until you know what your annual charge for goods/services will be.
I cannot comment on the question of being registered and paying out more than was coming in as I was only a sole trader and never exceeded that amount in my first 3 years.
In my experience, and many other sole traders I have spoken to, dont expect to earn a living wage in the first year or so. Advertising will be one of the biggest drains on your capital.
Also, just doing lockouts is not going to keep you afloat. You will need to diversify into lots of other areas:- Auto work (expensive equipment), UPVC fitting and replacement, emergency security shuttering, CCTV, alarms etc etc, the list goes on.

[EmCee]

...i was vat registered which with my own opinion I WILL NOT BE DOING AGAIN if possible, it caused me many money problems, i was paying out more then what was coming in even when you can claim back alot. Is anybody out there had the same problems with vat and think they are better off not registering, or maybe its just the catering industry that suffer.

Hi belldinger1 and welcome

I don't know enough about the catering industry to say whether it suffers more than other trades and industries or not, but I think the biggest impact is whether the business serves consumer or business markets.

If turnover is below the threshold when VAT registration is required, the decision on whether to voluntarily register for VAT must be based on an assessment of expenditure vs income.

However, you do not really pay out more than comes in because if you are VAT registered you charge VAT on all your invoices. Of course, the amount of VAT you pay may be more than the amount of VAT you reclaim for a particular period, but that's a different issue.

For example, if you supply goods or services to the value of £100 to a VAT-registered customer, then the invoice will show £100 plus £17.50 VAT. You end up with £100, the £17.50 goes to HMRC, and the customer only pays £100 because they reclaim the VAT they pay to you.

If you supply goods or services to the value of £100 to a customer who is not VAT registered, then you charge the customer £117.50, so you still end up with £100 and pay the £17.50 to HMRC. The customer in this case pays £117.50 since they cannot reclaim the VAT.

Either way, you don't pay out more than the amount that comes in because in both cases you charge the VAT to the customer and then pass it on to HMRC. You don't 'own' the £17.50 - it's not part of your income - although when you are running a business it is easy to forget that when cash is tight. If you spend the £17.50 then you have to find it out of other earnings when the VAT payment is due and if the amount you are reclaiming is less than the amount you owe, it is easy to think that you are paying out more than is coming in - but it's not really that way.

Of course, when you are supplying consumers (or others who are not VAT registered) in a competitive market where some of your competitors are not VAT registered, things become more difficult. If the market value of the service is £100 then your non-VAT registered competitor will charge the customer £100 but you will have to charge £117.50 to end up with the same amount. This may be difficult, so you end up charging £100 in order to compete, but then you have to account for VAT (a bit under £15) and end up with just over £85 for yourself.

On the other hand, you will be paying 17.5% less for all your supplies (tools, locks etc, fuel, phone bill, etc etc) compared with your non-VAT registered competitor. That's why much will depend on the balance between outgoings and income when decided whether to register or not.

Cheers...

[belldinger1]

yes thanks for that info, like you said my problem i did not put the vat money away, then i ended up wth a big hefty vat bill. or well i will learn from my mistakes.

[EmCee]

...my problem i did not put the vat money away, then i ended up wth a big hefty vat bill

Tell me about it ..I know exactly what you mean.

I am VAT registered and reckon that the amount I 'save' on purchases makes the hassle worthwhile, and I've taken it into account in my charges.

I don't want to sound like a pratt teaching you to suck eggs and I'm sure you already know but just in case...if you are a sole trader it's the person that is VAT registered, not the business. If your restaurant business was a limited company that's different, but if it was a sole trader business then you'll still be registered for VAT unless you have de-registered, which you'll have to do if you don't want to be VAT registered as a locksmith.

Cheers...

[79commando]

For mince, think the English Footbal team in the World Cup.

Currently almost all courses taught over a short time appear to specialise in bypassing locks, either by picking or drilling. If it's for a hobby anyone is as good as the next with the exception of one from the North East which is mince.

If it's for a new career move you're a couple of years too late as the market is swamped. Just do a search under the business section to see how little work is out there. Picking locks is about 5% of most locksmiths work now. There's more money in Dog Walking.

cant beat a straight answer commando ....top man

not sure what you mean by mince though is that good or bad cos im looking for a course myself