Bilock question

[Squelchtone]

anyone picking Bilock should really take a careful look at the keying of the lock in question, before assuming that the lock design is flawed / substandard etc.

I'm not saying that the lock is flawed or even substandard. The design is pretty cool.

It's their advertising that is horribly flawed and a blatant misleading lie. At least that's how I interpret their advertising (possibly because I can pick them blind ).

As has been pointed out earlier. It's one thing to say that a lock is pick resistant, and a completely different thing to say that it is entirely pick proof. It's those words that strike a nerve with a lot of people.

The Internet Way Back Machine is a fun place to look at manufacturer's website claims over the years..

Here's Medeco, already in 1998 (before all of us came along, lol) saying their locks were "virtually" pick proof: http://web.archive.org/web/199802201304 ... edeco.com/

Here's BiLock USA in 1996 saying "high pick resistance" http://web.archive.org/web/199612300952 ... ilock.com/

Enjoy poking around the different snapshots of manufacturer's web sites,
Squelchtone

[FarmerFreak]

Apparently they used to be both "Drill and Pick proof"
http://web.archive.org/web/200608141539 ... curity.htm

I never knew about the Internet Way Back Machine. Thanks Squelch.

[Evan]

:lol:

Apparently they used to be both "Drill and Pick proof"
http://web.archive.org/web/200608141539 ... curity.htm

I never knew about the Internet Way Back Machine. Thanks Squelch.

Yeah, that was back in the days before you could walk into a hardware store and buy your own hammer drill and order the special drill bits off the internet...

It used to require knowing who to call or where to go to get the tools rather than being good at Google searches and having a credit card whose billing address matches the shipping address...

~~ Evan

[FarmerFreak]

Evan, whether or not it requires special tools, knowledge, skill, etc... How does that change the fact that it could have been drilled open, and that they are advertising that it can not be drilled? I've have learned that that is a lie, would you seriously consider that not to be a lie?

And since they can be drilled open (even though it requires with special tools), would you feel good lying to a consumer by telling them that it is drill proof? It could land you in an awkward position if you ended up having to drill it later.

In my opinion, It's far worse to say that the lock is drill proof than it is to say that it is pick proof. It's much harder to find someone that can pick these locks, than it is to find someone that is capable of drilling them. Maybe that's why they stopped advertising them as drill proof. Either way, advertising them as proof to drilling and/or picking is bad form.

[Evan]

Evan, whether or not it requires special tools, knowledge, skill, etc... How does that change the fact that it could have been drilled open, and that they are advertising that it can not be drilled? I've have learned that that is a lie, would you seriously consider that not to be a lie?

And since they can be drilled open (even though it requires with special tools), would you feel good lying to a consumer by telling them that it is drill proof? It could land you in an awkward position if you ended up having to drill it later.

In my opinion, It's far worse to say that the lock is drill proof than it is to say that it is pick proof. It's much harder to find someone that can pick these locks, than it is to find someone that is capable of drilling them. Maybe that's why they stopped advertising them as drill proof. Either way, advertising them as proof to drilling and/or picking is bad form.

@FarmerFreak:

Because saying it can not be drilled open back when all the typical person has access to are normal twist drill bits is one thing... Remember back then safe crackers used to BLAST! rather than drill... Sure, you can drill it with the right drill bits, but how many of the wrong ones will it take you snapping off to do it without the right tool ? Not everyone has had the ability to purchase drill bits that can bite through hard plate... Now they are much more widely available...

I suppose if a safe can be easily opened in under an hour with a Lance torch that would take days or weeks with normal oxy-acetylene torches you would have issues if the manufacturer called it "burn resistant"...

Everyone gets so focused on whether or not a lock's cylinder can be drilled at the shearline or if it can be picked... Whenever I used to encounter high security cylinders that I did not have keys for or that had been vandalized and/or failed, drilling through the keyway was ALWAYS the last resort -- there was usually an easier way to separate the lock cylinder from the housing in most situations...

~~ Evan

[FarmerFreak]

I suppose if a safe can be easily opened in under an hour with a Lance torch that would take days or weeks with normal oxy-acetylene torches you would have issues if the manufacturer called it "burn resistant"...

No, I would have a problem with them calling it "Burn Proof"

See the difference?