Real Newbie Question

[grahambclg]

Hi,

Let me start by saying I know NOTHING about picking locks!! So please forgive what is likely a very easy question.

I have just bought an old 17th century oak chest or coffer at auction and I didn't realize the chest was locked. I am afraid I have no idea what kind of lock it is...lets assume period, whatever was used in the 17th century.

Can anyone suggest a way to unlock it with everyday household items. You know like hairpins or screwdrivers. I know that I can cut the lock but I would rather keep the original lock intact, after all it is a part of history.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

Tim

[WhiteHat]

could you show us a picture of the lock at all? it could help us identify it.

[JackNco]

it will be a lever or warded lock. it will probably be cheaper to get a lock smith in and even with experience ide get a pro in if its 17th century in case i damaged it. it will be low quality metal and not worth the risk.

[Chucklz]

Get a locksmith. A good one. Call several places, and talk to the actual locksmith(s) not someone who just answers phones. Describe the lock in detail if possible. You don't want some drill happy cowboy ruining the value of your antique.

If the chest is dated properly (country of origin please?) the lock will most likely be a warded lock, or a trivial lever lock, as the double action lever lock was not patented until 1778. However, you may have all sorts of fun, like false keyholes and who knows what kind of goodies.

[Eyes_Only]

Another upside of calling in a professional lockie is that maybe they can even fabricate you a working key for it.

[JackNco]

If the chest is dated properly (country of origin please?) the lock will most likely be a warded lock, or a trivial lever lock, as the double action lever lock was not patented until 1778. However, you may have all sorts of fun, like false keyholes and who knows what kind of goodies.

Double action lever?

Only thing ive even herd close to in relation is in hand cuffs. can you explain this? the only thing ive seen on simple European antiques is simple single levers and a few warded lock?

[DaveAG]

I think the "double action lever" refers to a lever that must be set so it is not too high and not too low, rather than a simple lever that must be generally lifted.

Warded locks of the era often had a single lever that needed to be lifted once the wards had been cleared, but it only had to clear the stump, not be set to the correct height.

[UWSDWF]

in the words of Robin Hood

"CALLLL A LOCKSMITH"

[DaveAG]

I can't find a link, but I have seen an entire exhibition of chests with "security" features that would make you wince. Quite literally in some cases.

One that comes to mind is a box with an obvious keyhole and a concealed one. The concealed one opens the box, the obvious one fires a steel spike into whoever is picking/opening the box.

Whilst I think such boxes were rare, there is always the chance that yours has some hidden surprises for you. The general principle of "hurt whoever tries to open this" has carried on for some time. The link below is a report into the injuries when the owner of a safe tightened some bolts, accidentally releasing the "chemical antitheft measures", i.e. glass vials of tear gas designed to give anyone drilling the safe a shock.

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5308a4.htm

[ponsaloti]

where are you

[Chucklz]

Ive taken "double action lever" here to mean that the lever must be raised to the correct height, and no further. Apparently in the first lever locks, the levers had to be raised to at least some height (so you could theoretically push them all the way up and be done with them).

[JackNco]

ah thats cool then, i was just a lil confused. all the levers ive had in bits would have been specific heights.

[DaveAG]

Hi,

Let me start by saying I know NOTHING about picking locks!! So please forgive what is likely a very easy question.

I have just bought an old 17th century oak chest or coffer at auction and I didn't realize the chest was locked. I am afraid I have no idea what kind of lock it is...lets assume period, whatever was used in the 17th century.

Can anyone suggest a way to unlock it with everyday household items. You know like hairpins or screwdrivers. I know that I can cut the lock but I would rather keep the original lock intact, after all it is a part of history.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

Tim

Personally I wouldn't ever play with a lock/chest this old as the cost of damaging it vs the cost of a locksmith to open it isn't worth it. Even if my skills are better than the professional, their insurance makes it worthwile to employ them.

However, if you are absolutely set on DIY'ing this I would start to attack the lock as follows (This assumes it is a warded lock)

1.) Find a blank that will insert and partially turn
2.) spread a thin film of candle-wax on the side of the key
3.) Turn the key as far as it will go
4.) Note the markings on the wax and remove the metal with a dremel or similar, so long as the key remains strong enough, removing too much metal is not a problem.
5.) Smooth the edges and remove excess wax
6.) Repeat steps 2, 3, and 4 until the key turns enough to unlock.

This all assumes it is a simple warded lock with at most one overliftable lever. If the lock is more complicated, then you will need a locksmith to open this as learning to pick lever locks takes time, and should be practiced on locks bought for the purpose, not antique chests.

[raimundo]

It would be nice to see a photo of this lock. as to calling a locksmith, don't hire him to open it, until you discuss the job with him, some of these guys only want the money and will destroy the lock and tell you to buy a new one, in the case of your lock, mostlikly, the box itself with the antique lock is the value, and better to leave it locked than destroy it. Also, you could do some research on it, see if you can find an antique lock expert by emailing some places like oldlock.com or whatever links you can find for the subject.
Many locks of the period mentioned, 17th century,will have only one or two movable parts in them and the locking principle is often just a very strong spring and some warding, remember in those days lockpicking was not very common, and strong small bits of metal werent as common as today by far, back then there were no scrapmetal piles except behind the blacksmiths shop. it was before the age of industrialization. Better you should hang around and learn about the various locking principles of today and realize that all are evolutions of very old lock, likely since you have the lock, its you that will become the expert. Do not become impatient with antiques, better to have them intact than destroyed. Careful looking will find books on old locks that will have photos of the simple lock type I described, and you may need to follow two theads to get it open, first this site on lockpicking where you will find different techinques, and some collectors and antique sites that may tell you what you need to know or may link you to antique locks expert. just do not become impatient, the box has been patient for centuries.

[Gordon Airporte]

The guys in Toool are working on an antique chest lock too:
http://www.toool.nl/blackbag/?p=117
So far they haven't had any luck, and if the best minds in European lock picking can't open this sort of thing, you might be up the creek Graham