Dont pick locks in use

[Raymond]

Here is a perfect example of why we should not practice on locks in use. I was called to fix this lock that a not-qualified locksmith tried to open. If you look very closely you can see a number two Best master wafer at the bottom of the keyway in the first three spaces. Even if you cant see all three, that is what are there. I had the control key but one of the first three cuts was a zero so raising the cuts by two would not remove the core. It had to be drilled.

[yegg57]

I have been a locksmith for 25 years and have experience with SFIC and LFIC locks.

I've not seen a situation where master pins come out of SFIC cores other than intentionally such as with the INSTAKEY system.

I am wondering a couple things.

1. The "non-locksmith" was attempting to open WHY? perhaps because the user's key wouldn't work because of a malfunction? Was the malfunction lost master pins to begin with?


2. With the tight tolerances in SFIC cores and with picking involving movement of the pin stack by contact with the bottom pin how exactly is an inept lock picker going to cause the loss of the master pins?

I'm thinking that the core(s) in question may have been so over-used that it had exceeded its life expectancy.

If I am wrong, please tell me how...

Thanks,
Charley

[Squelchtone]

2. With the tight tolerances in SFIC cores and with picking involving movement of the pin stack by contact with the bottom pin how exactly is an inept lock picker going to cause the loss of the master pins?

As a locksmith, do you pick locks, or do you mostly drill? I'm asking this seriously because I've met locksmiths over the years who never pick, and just go for the drill because time is money. I ask this because if you've ever picked an SFIC and turned the plug 180 degrees, or picked any lock and turned the plug 180 degrees, what happens? The spring loaded driver pins and any master wafers in the stack that happen to be up in the bible because the picking attempt pushed them up there creating a shear line between the key pin and the mater wafers, will get pushed into the keyway because unlike opening a lock with a key, there is no key to occupy the keyway space, its just an empty area now and just as the lock is picked and turned 180 degrees, sproing! the springs push drivers and master wafers into the keyway and they fall out. What will fall out and how many often depends how warded or paracentric the keyway is, and if the '"bottom of the keyway" is already very wide or worn out, then it does not take much effort for the master wafers to drop in.

Most folks here who have ever picked a lock and got it stuck at 180 degrees are not dealing with a master pinned SFIC core, so what ends up happening to them is the long driver pins (as compared to the tiny master wafers) hang down in the keyway, because of the springs pushing them into the keyway, and the plug will appear "stuck" The advice we give is to insert the long end of a tension wrench or the back of your half diamond pick, and apply tension while pushing up on all the driver pins that are slightly sticking into the plug's keyway, then you can correct the lock back to the normal position, and hear it click in place.

If all of that didn't make sense, another forum member, amlwchlocksmiths, took some nice photos on this very topic, please take a look here: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=47988

Hope that helps,
Squelchtone

[phrygianradar]

Squelchtone hit it on the head. I have had this happen to me; not on a lock that was in use, but an old junker that I was trying to pick for fun. The first time it happened was on accident, but I have done it on purpose before to try and clear out some of the build-up pins, or master pins, so I could try to pick it to the control a bit easier. I am not sure if it made it easier or not, but I would never do this on a lock that had keys. I have only had master pins come out of old junk SFIC cylinders that had no keys, and I plan on keeping it that way! This is a great case in point; don't pick locks in use, especially if you don't have an intimate knowledge of exactly how they work and why. When it comes to SFIC locks, most hobby lock pickers wouldn't have know this could happen; I didn't until it happened to me. Fortunately I wasn't messing with a lock that somebody needed to work properly. If that were the case I would have been hosed!

Thank you for sharing this post. This is good info for anyone who wants to know more about SFIC locks.

[Raymond]

Good answer Squelchtone. Saved me the longwinded answer.

I have been doing lock systems for this company for many years and had the control key. The maintenance man brought me the complete lockset because it would no longer work. He was not contacted during the fool-convention. He gave me the following explanation. This core was on a security door that had a storeroom function lock. The Dingbat stepped out to smoke a cigarrette and left his keys inside. This was on a weekend and the Dingbat called two different locksmiths to get him back in. The first looked at it, said something to the effect: "no way", and walked away. The second locksmith screwed up the lock and then did so much damage to the door that it will have to be replaced.

I am aware of the tight tolerances in SFICs. But, I have also lost master wafers when turning the plug around 180 degrees. I know that the wafer cannot fit through the holes in the sleeve. However, in this case the core was so worn that when they tried to insert a key, there was so much space that the wafers were pressed in place by the bottom of the key. I later had to use a punch to dislodge all three wafers. I side-lug drilled the core so as not to loose any pins and then reconstructed the complete bitting array. Anyway they got a new core pinned as original back in the lockset that now works again.