Shim troubles

[Cyber Samurai]

Hey everyone,

I recently purchased a set of padlock shims from southord. I've been trying them out, but haven't been able to get much success so far. I've been able to open a masterlock combination lock with no trouble, but I can't seem to get the shims to work on regular padlocks. I've tried (so far) as masterlock 10 and a masterlock 150. The 10 is an old POS that I can pick in under 10 seconds, but it refuses to shim. The thing that I don't understand is that I'm able to insert the shim all the way inside the lock, to the point where the lock mechanism should be blocked from locking on. I made a mark with a sharpie on the shackle where the shim sits when I've got it all the way in, and upon inspection with the lock open, the shim is more than all the way inside. I can lift the shackle up a tiny bit with the shim all the way in, but then it just seems to stick. If I remove the shim and push down on the shackle, I can clearly hear a "click" as the lock snaps back into place, so it seems like I should be able to open it all the way. I've tried pulling up on the shackle as I push in, but it isn't physically possible for the shim to go in any further. The same goes for the 150; the spring is harder on that one, but after some working I can get the shim in, only to experience the same problem. Anyone have an ideas as to what the problem could be, and how I could rectify it?


Cyber Samurai

[WhiteHat]

not that we usually talk about bypass methods here, but is the locking mechanism a ball or a latchy thing? balls are generally impervious to shimming (due to the fact that when locked, the shim hits the ball on the oposite side to the shackel and therefore cannot physically be inserted between the shackle and the ball) - as most good padlocks should be.

[MrB]

The shackle might be locked on both sides?

[felspar]

security.org has a diagram of a heel and toe (aka ball bearing) locking mechanism.

http://security.org/search/lss_02a_Display.cfm?ID=9805

When you open the lock and inspect the shackle, are there notches on both sides? If there is, you'll need to use 2 shims, one for each. There's an example at the bottom of my page on shimming.

http://www.ipaterson.ca/writings/locks/

[HeadHunterCEO]

if the lock is like an lsda ball bearing lock you aren't going to be able to shim it.

the reason is that when the lock is in the locked position the balls are forced into the shackle by a brass cam. there is little to no play between the cam and the shackle.

when you unlock the padlock the brass cam rotates exposing two cutouts meant for the ball bearings to fall into and allowing the shackle to be opened.

and for a real treat completely teardown an lsda ball bearing padlock and then put it back together.

[Cyber Samurai]

Like I said, it's a masterlock 10, so I don't think it has ball bearings. I looked at the shackle and compared it to the diagram provided, and I'm pretty sure it's just a normal lock. It does appear to have notches on both sides, but 2 shims doesn't make it budge any further. I'll keep working at it. Thanks for the suggestions.


Cyber Samurai

[felspar]

If the shackle and shims are a tight fit, I find that you need to give it a good yank before it will come out, especially if the dogs are still somewhat engaged.

[Johnny P]

I bought a set of those shims and I have to say, it's a waste of money as far as I'm concerned. Maybe the coke can home-made ones would work better.

[raimundo]

can you push the shackle in? doing this will use the cam shape of the cut on the shackle to press back the locking dog a little, then the shim may go in a little deeper, hold the shim in and pull the shackle back, then do it again, advancing the shim into the lock every time and using the little bit of play in the shackle to jack the locking dog back every time. It works on master combination locks.

[toomush2drink]

Ive found sometimes a bit of teflon spray can help as well as pushing the shackle closed whilst shimmng it. The thing is that most padlocks that succumb to this method are normally easy enough to pick imho.