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Master Combo 1500

Picked all the easy locks and want to step up your game? Further your lock picking techniques, exchange pro tips, videos, lessons, and develop your skills here.

Master Combo 1500

Postby Oldfast » 14 Mar 2011 23:37

I know, I know......this old horse has been beat to death

As I search the internet there must be a hundred videos on "cracking a masterlock". I used google to search this site and came up with more pages than I'd ever care to read. Typing in "Master lock 1500" narrowed my search to 4 pages, but still didn't really find anything new.

Everything I've found on this topic deals with the technique of finding 12 sticking points, 5 whole #'s, divide, add, subtract, etc.....we all know the drill. By the way, who ever came up with this is much smarted than me and I give you props. This method though, is somewhat time consuming and the "sticking points" can be very finicky- sometimes requiring you to record them right down to the decimal. Although the majority of locks I applied this method to were opened, overall, my success rate was less than desirable (but that's just me).

The method I've come to use invovles no math- just pure manipulation. If this method already exists, I've yet to see it, so I guess it's original to me anyway. (I'm not the brightest :idea: in the shed, and if I've figured this out, I'd be very surprised if it's not already common knowledge :oops: ). I've purchased 14 of these locks, all within the last 3 months (4 of them in the last week). This method works well on all of them and usually takes less than 60 sec. with each (after some practice).

Anyway, in the interest of time and possible redundancy- let me know if I'm just tootin' my own horn here :lol:.
If not, and there seems to be enough interest in this, I'd be happy to post my findings.
" Enjoy the journey, not the destination."
www.youtube.com/Oldfast911
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Re: Master Combo 1500

Postby Shyfted » 14 Mar 2011 23:44

Its hard to know whether your method is new or not when you dont give out any information at all about how you did it. That being said I'm pretty sure all combination lock opening belongs in the advanced forum (but i may be wrong)
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Re: Master Combo 1500

Postby Oldfast » 15 Mar 2011 1:01

Yea, I'm not sure if it's new or old news. That's part of the reason I haven't taken the time to elaborate on the method. The other reason, as you mentioned, is that this might be an "advanced" topic. Looking back on the forum years ago, anything having to do with combos seemed to be off limits. However, I see more recent threads that discuss at length the manipulation of other combination locks. So yea, I was a little leery. I'd be willing to bet we're about to find out one way or the other :lol:
" Enjoy the journey, not the destination."
www.youtube.com/Oldfast911
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Re: Master Combo 1500

Postby MBI » 15 Mar 2011 1:36

I'd sure like to hear about your method, either in a forum or in a pm.
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Re: Master Combo 1500

Postby Shyfted » 15 Mar 2011 1:39

Post it anyway. If its appropriate it will stay here, if not it will get moved.
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Re: Master Combo 1500

Postby raimundo » 15 Mar 2011 13:28

=1 on shyfted's solution,

we cant answer your question until we know what your talking about.
Wake up and smell the Kafka!!!
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Re: Master Combo 1500

Postby Oldfast » 16 Mar 2011 0:03

For the sake of clarity: Clockwise- If your turning CW from zero, your heading towards 35.
Counter Clockwise- If turning CC from zero, your heading toward 5.
ST= shakle tension (pulling up on the shackle as if you were going to open it)
It is this action that causes the pawl on the latching mechanism to come in contact with the cams, allowing us to 'read' what's going on inside the lock. The amount of force used here is crucial- too much and you'll catch every one of the 12 gates. Too little, and you'll miss the stopping points we'ere looking for.

Now, we're going to find 3 "stopping points". Two of these will be very dinstinct, the other, not so obvious. Using these 3 points, we'll derive the 1st and 2nd #'s of the 3-digit combination. I'm going to first attempt to explain how to find these points, then, we'll talk about actually utilizing them.

First, catch all the cams and clear the dial with several CW rotations. Now, apply ST and continue CW until reaching a "stopping point". Still applying ST, reverse directions, now turning CC until hitting the 2nd stopping point. Note: You'll have more than 2 full rotations before arriving at this 2nd point, and, you'll hear and feel 2 of the cams being picked up along the way.
TIPS: If you encounter alot of choppyness/bumps on your way to either of these points, too much ST is being applied. Keep in mind that some minor "bumps" are ok, and will not interfere with finding the stop points. However, if the dial is contantly being stopped (catching/snagging) at multiple points as you turn, the ST needs to be adjusted. Experiment, and you should be able to find the perfect ST which allows the dial to spin freely between these 2 points. Both points should be very solid. Meaning- it would require releasing ST and/or a decent amount of force on the dial to overcome it and continue turning. If your unsure about the reading your getting, go back and forth, hitting both points multiple times to ensure they're stopping on the same spots on the dial each time.

Now for the 3rd (not so obvious) stopping point. This one will require a bit more practice and patience. You've hit the 1st stop point, reversed direction (CC) and you're now setting on the 2nd point (still applying ST). Back the dial away from this point (CW) just a fraction (1mm or less). Now increase the ST by the slightest of margins (I cannot stress this enough- SLIGHTEST). Then continue CW to find the 3rd and final stopping point.
TIPS: This is nothing like finding the 1st 2 stop points. ST must be just right. Turn the dial very slowly and evenly. Focus on being light-handed with the dial. Using just your thumb and index finger, take a very loose grip toward the top of the knob. The grip should be such, that your fingers will begin sliding around the knob when any resistance whatsoever is encountered. Also, I find you don't always have to increase the ST when trying to catch this 3rd stop. Try it both ways and see what you come up with. Don't get discouraged. Even after all the practice I will still sometimes catch the wrong #, or, pass by the correct one. This just lets me know I need to adjust the ST on the next try. Even with a couple of tries it's still pretty quick overall.

OVERVIEW: Clear dial. Apply ST, rotate CW to 1st stop point. Keeping same ST, go CC to 2nd stop point. Increase ST slightly (if needed) and go CW to 3rd stop point.

WHAT THEY MEAN: Stop point #1; add 5 to this and you have the 1st # of the combo. If you happen to land in between 2 #'s, round up, then add 5 (ie. 31.5 you would round up to 32, then add 5. The 1st # would be 37). Oops, I said no math didn't I. Oh well, we won't be counting any higher than this, so you can leave your shoes on :)
Stop point #2; really just a reference point. It may also position the cams in such a way that allows us to catch the 3rd stop point.
Stop point #3; add 1 to this to get the 2nd # of the combination. Same principle applies if you land between two #'s.

So, clear the cams, dial in the first 2 #'s, then "run the clock" while pulling on the shackle every couple of #'s till it opens. A more elegant and less frantic way of doing this is to have enough ST so you can feel each time the pawl drops into a gate (the gates are about every 4 spaces on the dial). Pull the shackle at each of these 12 gates - one will pop the lock.

If your budget allows, I'd purchase a couple of these. I'd suggest starting with one of the original ones with a black dial, only because the two colored ones I have just seem to be a bit more finicky. Do yourself a favor and look at the combination before trying this method. Knowing the combo should help you more quickly adapt your technique for finding the correct stop points.

Several example locks: (remember, 1st & 3rd stops give us the first two combo #'s)
Lock #1: 3 stop points- 32,23.5,11 Lock opened with 37-12-29 Actual combo 37-11-29
Lock #2: stop points- 0,31,18 opened with 4-19-7 Actual combo 5-19-9
Lock #3: stop points- 0,32,6.5 opened with 5-8-0 Actual combo 5-7-1

One other thing. I may have stumbled upon an exception to this method. I've come across one that this doesn't seem to work on. I suspect the reason for this is the combo (10-16-10). The 1st and last digits are the same. I'll have to purchase a couple more like this and find out what the deal is. In the meantime here's what I do with this one. I use manipulation to find the 1st # coupled with the "12 stick points" method. This leaves me knowing the 1st and last #'s and 10 possibilities for the 2nd. Still only 10 possible combos to run through. Not bad compared to 80.

Whatta ya think? Stocking stuffers for the grandkids someday? :lol:

Image
" Enjoy the journey, not the destination."
www.youtube.com/Oldfast911
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Re: Master Combo 1500

Postby Oldfast » 18 Mar 2011 19:04

My very first video :D
6 combos cracked in about 2 minutes, along with an explanation of the technique.
I know I learn much better from seeing than reading, so hope this helps.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AHD__g4pS_c

Taped on a digital camera. Haven't quite worked out the audio.
I'd still love to hear if anyone is familiar with this method. I have
yet to find it anywhere on the internet.
" Enjoy the journey, not the destination."
www.youtube.com/Oldfast911
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Re: Master Combo 1500

Postby Shyfted » 23 Mar 2011 23:46

Has anyone else tried this and got it working?
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Re: Master Combo 1500

Postby Tinhajj » 26 Mar 2011 2:08

Shyfted wrote:Has anyone else tried this and got it working?


Yeah I tried this method today and it worked on the ones that have the black dial. I tried it on a blue dial one and it was confusing cause these stopping points seemed to come up everywhere.

I tried t his on 3 black dial ones and it worked all the time.
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Re: Master Combo 1500

Postby yono » 26 Mar 2011 4:55

thanks Oldfast, wether its an old or new method..it doesn't matter..what matter is you share that knowledge..for anyone to find for themselves..and learn from it. and anyone who not known it yet..(like me) its always new. regards.
hi everyone, im glad to be a member of this very interesting community, our community of locksmiths. i hope i could help others, within my ability, and hope you can help me too, God bless us all fellow locksmiths.
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Re: Master Combo 1500

Postby Oldfast » 26 Mar 2011 22:27

Thanks for the encouragement. Good to see someone's getting some enjoyment out of this.

If you're able to open several locks with this method, but come across one that doesn't seem to respond, I'd be interested in hearing details. As I mentioned in the "follow-up" video, I've found one such lock out of the 19 that I have. So any clues as to why this might be would be great.
" Enjoy the journey, not the destination."
www.youtube.com/Oldfast911
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Re: Master Combo 1500

Postby OrangePick » 1 Apr 2011 10:30

This is great stuff. Please keep us updated if you discover more about decoding locks with identical first/last digits. Had the wife grab one at Wal Mart for me yesterday and as luck would have it, it's one of "those." I didn't realize the combo was visible through the packaging or else I would have told her to get one with 3 unique numbers. Anyhow, I now have a same first/last that I can help you experiment with.
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Re: Master Combo 1500

Postby Oldfast » 2 Apr 2011 11:22

Thanks Orangepick. I've 4 locks that have the same first/last digits. Only one of the three doesn't seem to respond to this method. Since the other three work fine, I'm beginning to believe it makes no difference when the first/last digits are the same. So, odds are, I would think it'll work fine with the one you have. But let me know how it goes, the feedback's appreciated.
" Enjoy the journey, not the destination."
www.youtube.com/Oldfast911
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Re: Master Combo 1500

Postby Tinhajj » 2 Apr 2011 11:27

Oldfast wrote:Thanks Orangepick. I've 4 locks that have the same first/last digits. Only one of the three doesn't seem to respond to this method. Since the other three work fine, I'm beginning to believe it makes no difference when the first/last digits are the same. So, odds are, I would think it'll work fine with the one you have. But let me know how it goes, the feedback's appreciated.


You ever like pop open the metal back of the lock? I saw you can do it with a knife and just like lift up the edges of the metal that keeps the back plate on. Maybe you can find a pattern to your 10/x/10 combo lock.

I am gonna do that to a couple of mine just out of curiosity.
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