Mosler with no Combination

[Squelchtone]

I think this change key would work but at $40 dollars it's risk to buy it if I am wrong.

https://time-master.com/products/HPSLC33

[L4R3L2]

I think this change key would work but at $40 dollars it's risk to buy it if I am wrong.

https://time-master.com/products/HPSLC33

Thanks for sharing that supplier. It looks like there may be a typographical error on that listing. I believe it's supposed to be KCD-12. Anyway, I was thinking this one, as it's for a KCB-1, which may also relate to KC-1.

https://time-master.com/products/HPSLC32

I don't see one specifically for a KC-1, so I'm not sure either. I'm not even certain the lock is a KC-1, but it's the closest visual match I could find.

[Squelchtone]

I think this change key would work but at $40 dollars it's risk to buy it if I am wrong.

https://time-master.com/products/HPSLC33

Thanks for sharing that supplier. It looks like there may be a typographical error on that listing. I believe it's supposed to be KCD-12. Anyway, I was thinking this one, as it's for a KCB-1, which may also relate to KC-1.

https://time-master.com/products/HPSLC32

I don't see one specifically for a KC-1, so I'm not sure either. I'm not even certain the lock is a KC-1, but it's the closest visual match I could find.

one way to tell if it's the right one, would be to remove the wheels or align the gates over the change key hole area and see if the lock case has a hole in it or a dimple to accept the tip of that change key.

[MartinHewitt]

I think it is a KCB-107. The change key would be then apparently that one https://time-master.com/products/HPSLC11 . You could perhaps ask time-master with a few photos of your lock.

[L4R3L2]

I think it is a KCB-107. The change key would be then apparently that one https://time-master.com/products/HPSLC11 . You could perhaps ask time-master with a few photos of your lock.

According to the Reed's manual, the KCB-107 drives from the front. Also, the fence on this one looks much larger than what I see on the KCB-107 drawing in the manual.

[L4R3L2]

OK, I found a near perfect match called a KCB-401, except that the KCB-401 is a four wheel lock (i.e. four number combination). The 3-wheel version is the KCB-101, so that is almost certainly what you have, and they both take the same change key that I linked above (SLC-32).

I'm not sure how a 4-wheel and 3-wheel lock take the same change key, but that is what the key listing shows. From what I surmise, the change keys lacking the indexing tit on the end are for locks having full diameter front drivers.

[jeffmoss26]

wow, what a cool safe!

[matchframe]

OK, I found a near perfect match called a KCB-401, except that the KCB-401 is a four wheel lock (i.e. four number combination). The 3-wheel version is the KCB-101, so that is almost certainly what you have, and they both take the same change key that I linked above (SLC-32).

I'm not sure how a 4-wheel and 3-wheel lock take the same change key, but that is what the key listing shows. From what I surmise, the change keys lacking the indexing tit on the end are for locks having full diameter front drivers.

Thanks!!

This is a four number combination.

[L4R3L2]

This is a four number combination.

I could be wrong, but bear with me for a bit. I believe your lock is a three number combination lock. Here's why.

Your last number, 0, is just where the fence naturally falls into the gates. You should NOT have to reverse direction to unlock the lock at this point.

In reviewing your description and video, it seems your idea of turn direction defintions ("left" and "right") is opposite what those of us who are safe men use. To clarify, "left" should be counter-clockwise, and "right" should be clockwise.

I believe I only see three combination wheels in your lock. Three combination wheels mean a true three number combination (The smaller wheel is not a true combination wheel). Many wheels have what are called movable flies, which often enables dialing from either direction. I believe the wheels in your lock have movable flies, but I cannot see for sure.

So, try this. Let's assume your lock is a three number combination lock of 25-50-25. I'll use "CW" and "CCW" to hopefully avoid confusion.
Turn the dial CW (clockwise) at least two times (go four times to make everyone happy) and stop at 25.
Turn the dial CCW and stop at 50 when it reaches the index line the third time.
Turn the dial CW and stop at 25 when it reaches the index line the second time.
Turn the dial CCW past 0 ("click") and keep going CCW until it stops (around 12, the lock is unlocked).

It's possible that someone may have set this lock while turning the wrong way, and the movable flies may not be in precise tolerance to use the same numbers when reversing direction. In this case, you would have to adjust some numbers slightly. At any rate, if this is a three wheel lock (you can verify this by counting the wheels that are all the same, larger diameter), the correct dialing sequence is CW, CCW, CW, then CCW to stop (or, in other words, RLR, then L to stop).

[matchframe]

This is a four number combination.

I could be wrong, but bear with me for a bit. I believe your lock is a three number combination lock. Here's why.

Your last number, 0, is just where the fence naturally falls into the gates. You should NOT have to reverse direction to unlock the lock at this point.

In reviewing your description and video, it seems your idea of turn direction defintions ("left" and "right") is opposite what those of us who are safe men use. To clarify, "left" should be counter-clockwise, and "right" should be clockwise.

I believe I only see three combination wheels in your lock. Three combination wheels mean a true three number combination (The smaller wheel is not a true combination wheel). Many wheels have what are called movable flies, which often enables dialing from either direction. I believe the wheels in your lock have movable flies, but I cannot see for sure.

So, try this. Let's assume your lock is a three number combination lock of 25-50-25. I'll use "CW" and "CCW" to hopefully avoid confusion.
Turn the dial CW (clockwise) at least two times (go four times to make everyone happy) and stop at 25.
Turn the dial CCW and stop at 50 when it reaches the index line the third time.
Turn the dial CW and stop at 25 when it reaches the index line the second time.
Turn the dial CCW past 0 ("click") and keep going CCW until it stops (around 12, the lock is unlocked).

It's possible that someone may have set this lock while turning the wrong way, and the movable flies may not be in precise tolerance to use the same numbers when reversing direction. In this case, you would have to adjust some numbers slightly. At any rate, if this is a three wheel lock (you can verify this by counting the wheels that are all the same, larger diameter), the correct dialing sequence is CW, CCW, CW, then CCW to stop (or, in other words, RLR, then L to stop).

Oh ok, that makes sense. I appreciate you taking time to write this.

Right now I turn the dial CCW for the first number, then CW for the second number, then CCW for the third, then CW to zero. Are you saying that when I get a change key, I should dial the numbers CW, then CCW, then CW then CCW to zero?

[matchframe]

Remember that my safe was inside another safe. The guy who bought that safe in an auction took the lug door safe out and I bought the lug door safe. He sent me a picture of the change key that is for his safe which should also work for mine since they were actually two safes in one. Here the change key picture he sent me.

So, I just need to match this key to one on that site where I can buy a change key, correct?

[image][/image]

[Squelchtone]

If he could send you a photo with the key next to a ruler, you could fashion your own change key if buying or finding one is difficult.. if he is willing to let you borrow it for a day that's even better.

Squelchtone

[matchframe]

If he could send you a photo with the key next to a ruler, you could fashion your own change key if buying or finding one is difficult.. if he is willing to let you borrow it for a day that's even better.

Squelchtone

That is a good idea! I would bet he would let me borrow it for a day.

[L4R3L2]

Are you saying that when I get a change key, I should dial the numbers CW, then CCW, then CW then CCW to zero?

Probably. But, I wouldn't really know until you try dialing the sequence as I outlined, and/or maybe see how many large diameter wheels are in your lock.

That change key looks a bit longer than my SLC-32 key. But, the number 1 stamped on it leads me to assume it is Mosler's key for their KCB-1 lock, which is the same as the SLC-32 key. Otherwise, it's also possible that change key may be for the lock in the main safe, which may not necessarily be the same as the one in your inner safe. Worth a try, though.

[ldj]

[image][/image]
[image][/image]

Hello,

I just bought this safe and do not have the combination to it. I did some search here before posting but thought I would introduce myself. I am Bill Overton and live on the Texas Gulf Coast. I also have a Hall Safe dated 1846 (174 years old) that I inherited from my Grandfather that I used frequently. We were flooded during Hurricane Harvey in August 2017. The Hall safe went totally under water for four days. When I was able to get back to our house about a week later, one of the first things I did is I opened the Hall safe knowing that if I waited too long, I may not be able to open it. I plan to restore that safe some day, just have not gotten to it yet, we had a house to rebuild.

Recently I have been on the look out for another safe that I could use. There is a guy in our area that bought several Mosler safes in auction from the Post Office. He sold all but one and restored that one for himself. The safe that was inside, he did not have the combination for so he pulled it out. He had to grind the welds that held the smaller safe inside. I bought that smaller safe for $50 this last Saturday. I used my trailer to get it home. Man, is that safe HEAVY!

Now that I have the Mosler home, I need to get to work figuring out the combination. I included a couple of picture of it while it was still on the trailer. I had just gotten it home when I took the pictures. We drove through some rain which is why it is wet in the pictures.

Can someone tell me more about this safe by looking at the pictures? I was told it was built in 1939, but I have not found any dates, model numbers or serial number on it. I would bet those are on the larger safe that this one was pulled from.

Any comments or advice is welcome.

Thanks!

I just bought a safe and the inside safe looks like yours except the dial is different and the 4 fasteners on mine has bolt head instead of screwdriver slot. I didn't know about the red lines to line up. I scraped off a layer of paint and and found red line but looks like they are painted on over maybe another layer of paint. In what position should those lines be when I try default combination?

https://ibb.co/KL96nXT

https://i.ibb.co/9VqnPNQ/IMG-20230731-141443651.jpg