Amsec Star Lift out door combination

[StahlMaster]

Enclosed you will find photos of my Amsec Star S7 lift out door. It is in the "open" position. Judging by the photos, will I be able to find out what the current combination is?

[Altashot]

I am not sure you can ask this question on this open forum. I think it may belong in the advanced section. I will let an admin decide.
In short, just by looking at the picture, I can't tell but if I had it in hand, i could.

M.

[StahlMaster]

I am not sure you can ask this question on this open forum. I think it may belong in the advanced section. I will let an admin decide.
In short, just by looking at the picture, I can't tell but if I had it in hand, i could.

M.

Not a problem. I can wait. Here is some background on my ordeal:
I had a locksmith try to open the safe found in the basement floor of the
house I bought in 2009. He was unable to open it by dialing combinations
for over an hour. We both looked high and low for any clue to the
combination. I contacted the couple that I bought the house from and they
didn't even know there was a safe there. They thought it was a drain because of the dust cover. The
locksmith ended up drilling it out. He told me what the combination was.
He took the door with him and I thought the door was trash. After sometime
I began to think I might want to use the safe again and began searching the
internet. That's when I found out sometimes these drilled out doors can be
repaired. I called the locksmith only to find them out of business. (he may have retired) I
looked at new doors, $390.00!!. Sooo....I found this one on e-bay.
My question is: Can I find out what the combination is with the
door now in my hands?
The lock is in the "open" position. I would really like to do this myself, as
I'm always learning something new. It's not that I don't want to spend the
money, the first locksmith charged me $245.00, it's just that I want to know
if I can do it myself. Thank you in advance.

[MacGyver101]

The short answer (to the extent that I can get into it in the public forums) is yes: you absolutely can figure out the combination, with very little effort, if you have the back off the lock. Do a quick Google search for "how combination safe locks work", take some more close-up photos of the silver wheels on the back (as a reference), and watch what happens to them as you spin the dial to lock it. You'll figure it out pretty quickly.

If you couldn't see the inside of the lock, then it's a very different problem to solve.

[Squelchtone]

Hello,

As previously mentioned in this post, we talk about safes in a private area of the forum, reserved for trusted members.

Since your question is for figuring out a combination of an already opened safe, I see no harm in it, but please excuse our hesitation to get deep into any details.

Take a look at this PDF: http://amsecsafes.com/instruction_bookl ... ndDoor.pdf

to know proper dialing order of how many times left and how many times right, check this out:
http://amsecsafes.com/instruction_bookl ... ndDoor.pdf

I believe this Service Manual has the dialing instrctions for your C7:
http://amsecsafes.com/instruction_bookl ... Manual.pdf


That gold colored L shaped thing over your wheelpack is going to make it hard to view the gates aligning under the fence, but that's what you will have to see in order to tell the corresponding numbers of the combination when looking on the other side of the door at the dial.

Basically as you dial on the outside, keep looking at the cutouts (gates) on the wheels inside the lock, and when they are over the metal bar (fence) that wants to drop into those gates, you then reverse direction to pick up another wheel and see when it's gate is under the fence.

With enough dialing Left and Right multiple times and a good eye, you should be able to figure it out, but only if you learn what some of the parts are called and how they interact. I'll PM you a video of me dialing a Major round floor safe, so you can see the wheels moving, I prefer not to post it here.

good luck with your project, should be a fun Saturday night thing to work on.

Squelchtone

[spooky]

I won't give away any secrets but if you watch the inside of the lock as you turn the dial, it will become pretty obvious what needs to line up for the lock to unlock. From that you should be able to figure it out.

Just make sure you have it right before you put the door in or you'll be calling a locksmith again.

[Legion303]

That gold colored L shaped thing over your wheelpack is going to make it hard to view the gates aligning under the fence, but that's what you will have to see in order to tell the corresponding numbers of the combination when looking on the other side of the door at the dial.

He can line up the gates on a part where he can see (like that post around the 5 o'clock position in the pic), get the relative numbers, and then work out how many he'll have to add/subtract from each one to get the gates back around to the fence...

-steve

[Squelchtone]

That gold colored L shaped thing over your wheelpack is going to make it hard to view the gates aligning under the fence, but that's what you will have to see in order to tell the corresponding numbers of the combination when looking on the other side of the door at the dial.

He can line up the gates on a part where he can see (like that post around the 5 o'clock position in the pic), get the relative numbers, and then work out how many he'll have to add/subtract from each one to get the gates back around to the fence...

-steve

Correct. I didn't want to get into transferring, etc, but yes, that's a perfectly good way of getting the numbers.

Squelchtone

[Altashot]

He can also make a mark with the sharpie where the change squares are right now and dial them to that position again and direct read.
Less math that way.
I think this is as far as we can go on this.

M.

[Squelchtone]

He can also make a mark with the sharpie where the change squares are right now and dial them to that position again and direct read.
Less math that way.
I think this is as far as we can go on this.

M.

Oh that's sneaky! =) I learn new things every day here. Thanks!

Squelchtone

[StahlMaster]

OK. Here's what happened. As I stated before, the door came to me in the open position. I removed the wheel pack cover and came to this forum. I'm a mechanic by trade and was sure I can somehow, someway figure out the combination. However, I wanted to check with the professionals first. In the mean time I read everything I could about this lock and similar ones of this type. I took pictures of the door. A lot of them. I scribed a mark on the gates as a reference to where they were. Then I read some more and watched videos and waited for any replys to my post. I didn't want to lock the door only to find out that I shouldn't have. Sooo.....after reading these posts I went to town on the door. PRESTO. GOT IT. It was VERY easy AND exciting! I checked and rechecked the numbers. Opening and locking the door. I tried one number off from the first number, then one number off from the second number and the third. I wanted to make SURE this is the combination. So far so good. I learned a lot. I'll play with it for awhile and watch how everything works. I was afraid to buy a door with no combination because I thought I'd have to be a rocket scientist to get the proper combination but thanks to this forum (and the private messages) I got it. I feel so smart now LOL.
Thanks for the help. I look forward to reading and learning more on the subject.

D

[Altashot]

Good job! I guess being a mechanic helped. Being mechanically inclined is a good thing in this field.
Don't stop here! Now you have to take it all apart and service it! Really get to know your safe!

M.

[Squelchtone]

Congrats man! =) dont forget to lube it up so it gives you years of trouble free service.

Altashot, I recently serviced a Major safe like this and didn't know what to lubricate the part where the plate and the bolts slid against each other, so I used white lithium grease from a spray can. I had flushed the amber honey colored goo off the plate and the holes where the bolts go through the door with Brake Kleen, and then sprayed the white lithium every where things moved against each other, EXCEPT for the wheel pack, I did not spray anything on the wheels. What would you recommend as the proper lubricant for boltwork?

Thank you,
Squelchtone

[Altashot]

Lithium grease is what I use. I use it out of the tube or tub but if the spray leaves a thin film where things rub, should be fine.
I also put a thin layer on the wheel pack post, but the wheels and flies must remain dry. A little inside the post for the drive cam and a bit around it's perimeter for the gate.

From what I read in other posts about you safe experiences, Squelchtone, you're doing fine.

M.

[StahlMaster]

He can also make a mark with the sharpie where the change squares are right now and dial them to that position again and direct read.
Less math that way.
I think this is as far as we can go on this.

M.

M,
That's just what I did!
D