HHM lug door problem

[bitbuster]

I recently acquired a Herring-Hall-Marvin safe with an inner safe.It's the inner lug door that is causing me problems.If anyone has Dave McOmie's Safe Opening Volume III you can see the lug door on page 108-109.If not,it's a lug door with their own 3 hole-change wheeled lock with the driver in front.One locking bolt at 3 o'clock.After taking off the wheel pack I got the combination.I reassembled wheel pack and tested the combination 3 times with the door OPEN.Combination worked all 3 times so I put on the backplate and shut the door.The lugs stopped at the half way point and would go no further.I checked the locking bolt and the fixed and movable lugs for any metal burrs and removed them.I tried to close the door and it would only go to the half way position.I then removed the wheel pack,the locking bolt and the fence and fence gear.The door will not go any further than the half way point.It's not the relocker because with the bolt removed it has nothing to do.The safe is sitting on it's back in my truck bed.Just don't know what could be the solution.Any helpful hints???

[GWiens2001]

Since you dealing with a door that is stuck open, and the lock removed, why don't you try (with the door open) to move the handle and see if the bolts will move freely when the door is wide open. If yes, find what is bent and keeping the door from closing. If not, find where the door is binding against the frame (or the bolts stuck too far out for the door to close).

Don't mind posting this, since it can not be used to open the safe.

Good luck,

Gordon

[bitbuster]

I have turned the handle with door open.The door works just fine in the open position but when door is shut the lugs just do not mesh for the complete rotation.The hinge arms have little to no play in them.I can't visually detect any warpage.Just for a better visual the fixed body lugs are at 12-3-6-9.The movable door lugs are at 1.5-4.5-7.5-10.5 .

[GWiens2001]

Try putting a sheet of paper between the door and the safe. Hold it in place with tape. Then try closing the door. If you can find exactly where the binding is occuring, you are half way to fixing it. (Of course, that second half can be the tricky part!)

Gordon

[mhole]

I can't offer any info about the safe, but the fact it's on its back in your truck could be related - try standing it upright - I've known safes to distort under their own weight if not sitting in their normal orientation, causing sticky doors etc.

[Squelchtone]

Any helpful hints???

photos.. we need photos. take pics and upload them to http://tinypic.com/then Paste the [IMG] forum picture links here.

Was the lug door closed when you first had the safe laying flat on its back in your truck bed and you pulled up and opened it? is it a hinge problem? I have the book at home so I cant look at the photos you mentioned.

Does the dial retract the bolt or is there a handle that retracts it or is the handle just a pull handle that does not move? Is it the kind where the round bolt is in the top left lug and the other lugs are solid metal?

Thanks
Squelchtone

[bitbuster]

the lug door was shut but in the open position.the locking bolt is tucked under one of the safe door's lugs. after dialing correct combo,the geared fence retracts the locking bolt.the handle,(at 9 o'clock) is then rotated clockwise until open.so remember,the door front and all its components is rotated clockwise.i also wondered about it being on its back like you did squelch but i poo-pooed that idea.but since you did mention it i will give it a try rightside up.i poo-pooed it because it seemed too obvious and that situation never occurred beforeon any safe i had worked..also GW2001.i tried the paper trick and nothing bound until the half way point like before.there was space around the entire door.i will attempt pics.

[bitbuster]

i put the safe upright on its wheels .this safe measures 20 x 20 x 28" tall but weighs 400 lbs.the lug door still does not fully close.i'm baffled.

[Squelchtone]

i put the safe upright on its wheels .this safe measures 20 x 20 x 28" tall but weighs 400 lbs.the lug door still does not fully close.i'm baffled.

does this door turn into the safe body like a screw (think cannonball safe) or is it just a normal hinge(s) like a normal square door safe?

maybe it's swollen due to the humidity... lol (yeah yeah, I know it's made of metal and not wood. )


but in all seriousness, when you said the door "front and all parts rotate" could it not be shutting all the way because.. I donno, do you have to push or pull the handle so the front of the door rotates some more in one direction or another?

I cant wait to see photos..

[bitbuster]

when rotated 1/4 turn CCW,the door lugs are supposed pass beneath (mesh) the fixed safe body lugs so all lugs in the fully locked position will be at the 12--3--6--and 9 o'clock positions.mine stop meshing after a 1/8 turn.(even with the lock bolt removed).i'm going to take a temporary break from this diabolical safe and take a road trip to the quad city area to visit relatives. i'll get back to the safe next week .hope to get pics to better show what i'm up against.

[Raymond]

I'm betting it is either a hinge alignment problem or there is some foreign matter gumming up the clearance. I couldn't count the number of times I have solved the door closing problem by picking out some dirt, paper, or small gravel from the door path. I am amazed that an office full of mechanical engineers could not see a small pebble on the threshhold of their office door and pick it up to make the door close fully without slamming.

[bitbuster]

well...i never did solve the lug door problem but i did sell the safe "as is".i think that somewhere in this safe's history the hinge/hinge arms got tweeked or the door was slammed while in the closed position or maybe the safe was dropped.whatever it may have been just set something out of alignment.thanks to forum members who responded.

[Raymond]

Aw Shucks, What a bummer, Hope you got at least a dollar a pound. We were all hoping to find out the real final fix. Good luck next time.

[bitbuster]

Just another mention of the safe I had lug door problems with.The person I sold it to now has it on an online auction.There are pics.If you'd like to see the pics, go to smith sales and click current auctions,go to October 15 auction and put "safe" in search.

[choptop]

How Ironic, I just bought that safe, the inner safe would not seat properly when closed, handle would not go to closed position and it is now jammed, dial is stuck on last number w/movement across 4 numbers. lol HELP