Joseph bates & sons patent lock

[ratlock]

Hi I hope I am ok posting a Utube link about safes. This was one I bought from a house that was getting cleared in Aberdeen. It sold on ebay for 99p. I hadnt the experiance to pick it,and could feel somthing weird happening where the last lever should be.
Well Dave (wellington) come over, and with his help we had a look inside.
Hope you find it informative.

Ratlock.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-b2oeWWet8c

[GWiens2001]

Question on the tool you used to open the safe - I see the part that applies tension to the bolt, but where is the part that will manipulate the levers?

Gordon

[ratlock]

Question on the tool you used to open the safe - I see the part that applies tension to the bolt, but where is the part that will manipulate the levers?

Gordon

Hi Gordon. I tried Unsuccesfully to open it with a 2 in 1 you see at the start of the clip. the final tool to get it open was an engineers scriber in the expert hand of Dave AKA Wellington.

[kwoswalt99-]

We need some high resolution pics of the lock.

[ratlock]

I will post up pics soon. 3 of the levers had snapped springs, and this may be why it stopped being used. I will rob some springs off other locks and get it back working again.

[ratlock]

Here goes some picks ( i hope)

[ratlock]

When your in the lock with your pick, on what feels like lever 7, is actually the floating bolt.

I clunks clockwise and anti clockwise. Trapping your pick, and moving the stump out the way too.

Hope you enjoy the pictures. Joseph Bates & son Patent lock.

Ratlock

[kwoswalt99-]

Thanks for the pics. Seems to be a primitive anti-pressure system, but I don't think it's working properly.

[ratlock]

Thanks for the pics. Seems to be a primitive anti-pressure system, but I don't think it's working properly.

Could you show me what a modern working system looks like.

[kwoswalt99-]

Thanks for the pics. Seems to be a primitive anti-pressure system, but I don't think it's working properly.

Could you show me what a modern working system looks like.

I don't know of any manufacturers that make them any more. Chatwood and Cotterill are too more famous lock makers that used them, but I don't have any pics that I took myself. It doesn't look like the secondary bolt is engaging it's stump, and I think the spring is on the wrong side of the pin, but it could just be the pic.

[ratlock]

@kwoswalt99 You were right about the pictures being not quite right. I had a little more time today and took more pics of how it sits when working correctly.

[ratlock]

This is a view from the side giving you an idea of the gates in the detainers

[kwoswalt99-]

The secondary bolt spring is on the wrong side of the pin.

[ratlock]

No its not. I tried it on the other side of the pin and it doesnt work at all.
Look at the rectangular post, and the round post at the back of the bolt assembly, and you will see how they interact with each other, and how the spring in its current place works when the whole thing slides back.

[kwoswalt99-]

No its not. I tried it on the other side of the pin and it doesnt work at all.
Look at the rectangular post, and the round post at the back of the bolt assembly, and you will see how they interact with each other, and how the spring in its current place works when the whole thing slides back.

In its default locked position the stump shouldn't be in its notch. It defeats the entire purpose of the secondary bolt. If it doesn't work correctly with the spring on the other side, then it needs to be modified so that it does.