Newbie- Grandfathers safe/York/1888/ combo not working

[Fitzgig]

https://ibb.co/qgtPfqs

https://ibb.co/hZVTtKB

https://ibb.co/jZ2YTzP

[ADMIN EDIT: I edited your links a little. This is what you would need to display a picture using the [IMAGE] command:
https://i.ibb.co/KzkgXDp/22287-CA1-021-B-4-CE5-9-B87-9-EC726951686.jpg



https://ibb.co/JCBN4xQ

https://i.ibb.co/7bYH5g4/5-B4-FC271-96-BE-43-D9-B421-818-CB9-EBD75-C.jpg


I have my great grandfathers old safe. It is empty and locked closed. I have the combination, but cannot get it open. I think it is interesting and it has significant meaning to me, so I do not want to scrap it. It weighs about 800 pounds.

See pictures - It is a York safe and the combo dial has a serial number and a date of 1880 on it. My grandfathers instructions with combination and instructions are also pictured.

I have tried many variations to the combination (along with following grandfathers written instructions) based on what I have read on this site and elsewhere. For example - L 4 spins, R to first number after passing it once, L to third number after passing it twice, and the R to stop ( which doesn’t happen). Also L 4 spins then L spin to first number, then 2 full spins R and then to second number, the spin L and go past third number once continuing spin L to third number again, the spin R until it either stops of you hear a click. Have tried several other spins too, but no luck.

The dial feels “gummy” at times. The last time I saw it open was over 15 years ago when my dad opened it before he passed - which is how I know it’s empty. It has been neglected in a cold garage. Is there any hope in resurrecting this beast and getting it open and usable again? Any help/advice appreciated!

[Squelchtone]

Hello and thank you for sharing your nice safe with us!

If you are confident that the combination you have written down is for this safe, then try this to open it:

Some terminology to make sure we're on the same page:
"Turn dial Left" means in the counter-clockwise direction
"Turn dial Right" means in the clockwise direction

Instructions:

1. Turn dial Left passing 28 three times, stop on 28 the fourth time around
2. Turn dial Right passing 62 two times, stop on 62 the third time around
3. Turn dial Left passing 48 one time, stop on 48 the second time around
4. Turn dial Right and continue turning it until you get to somewhere around 4 where the dial should stop and not let you turn it any farther.
5. Turn handle
6. Pull door open

Good luck,
Squelchtone

[Safecrackin Sammy]

It is possible that the lubricant in the lock has congealed and you are doing the combination correctly, but the wheels are dragging off due to the gummy lubricant.

[Fitzgig]

Thanks Squelchtone and Safecracking Sammy. I tried your instructions Squelchtone - several times - and no luck. The final rotation does not result in any “stop” (at the number 4 or anywhere).

I am about 90% certain it is the correct combo. It was taped to the back of the safe. Your term clarification and image attachment instructions were very helpful. I hope I got the image code right this time (below). Thank you.

The drag on the dial is really noticeable as I rotate past the numbers 70-100, but it is still able to turn. I am wondering if Sammy is right about the “gumminess” interfering with the the wheels. Would warming the dial area maybe help to reduce the gummy? Or any other hints/help really appreciated. I really want to salvage my family history.

Just for some context, this safe lived its life in the garage in the attached image. This is my grandfather in front of the garage in 1926! The old behemoth of a safe is tugging at my heart strings.

[Safecrackin Sammy]

Warming the dial area with a hair dryer or waiting for warmer temps may help. Work the dial back and forth long runs with a leather belt and also work the handle. Rap the door with a mallet or block of wood. I have seen modern safe locks freeze up from lack of use and not open with the correct combination so 15 years is a good long time. Be patient.

[Fitzgig]

Sigh, I will keep trying. The warming with a hairdryer did make it spin more easily for a while. As it cooled the stickiness came back. I did a lot of leather belt dial spinning and tapping on door, dial, and lever with a rubber mallet. No luck.

Since the York Company went out of business in 1942, I guess the serial number is of no value? I will be patient and keep trying, but in the meantime does anyone know of a locksmith for safes in the Ann Arbor, Michigan area? *or* does anyone have any additional suggestions or advice for me? Thanks so much.

[Squelchtone]

There is the chance that teh instructions you found do indeed open the safe, but they are probably not the actual combination.

28 is probably the 1st actual number

48 is probably the 3rd number of the combination.

62 is probably nothing, it doesn't feel like the correct amount of turns to turn and park the 2nd combination wheel.

The combo is probably 28-28-48, you could try my instructions with 28-28-48 in place of 28-62-48

Some safes I've come across had two of the wheels set to the same number, which made it easier to remember, but more confusing to dial.

There's a shop in Wixom, NorthEast of Ann Arbor, called JK Locksmith Co (https://www.facebook.com/JK-Locksmith-C ... 693293416/), their registered safe technician is listed as Jesse Kippola, I found him on the http://www.savta.org/savta_tech.php? Safe & Vault Technicians Association website.

There is also AAA Blue Star Safe & Lock in Garden City, MI East of Ann Arbor (https://www.facebook.com/AAA-Blue-Star- ... 2057910684) Their registered safe technician is listed as Jamie Belcher.

You could reach out to either or both, but they're probably gonna charge you A. a service visit fee to come out, B. $250-$750 to open the safe by manipulation (dialing it open by hand like a movie safe cracker would, or using an auto dialer machine), or by "drilling and scoping" where they drill a 1/4 inch or smaller hole, and use a medical rigid borescope to take a peek inside the lock mechanism and align the wheels while they turn the dial. then they would service the lock, set a combination, make sure it works well and show you how to dial it. A tech will typically repair the little hole they drilled and safe would be good as new.

Hope this helps,
Squelchtone

[Raymond]

The original instructions left out a turn on the last number. From 62 there should be one complete turn to the left and then right to 48. Dial this and oscillate in the drop area. This looks like the standard 4-3-2-1, LRLR. I believe the instructions Squelchtone gave were right on but might not have been followed exactly.

[Fitzgig]

Thanks Raymond. I have followed Squelchtone’s instructions to a T. — numerous times, but still no luck. I agree that it is most likely a 4321 LRLR. Tomorrow is another day, and I will keep at it. Learning a lot from you all. Thanks!

[Fitzgig]

PS- thanks Squelchtone for your solid response on 3/20!

[MartinHewitt]

Might it be a York with a Yale friction fence lock, which dials the other direction? Probably not unless the person writing the note had a problem with left and right, but not much work to check it.

[Fitzgig]

Thanks Martin. I will try reversing the sequence just to give it a try. I keep coming back to Safecracker Sammy’s advice — patience, patience…..