High security Europrofile cylinder(100€+) for armored door

[Loukanikidis]

Hi,

I'm planning to upgrade the whole lock mechanism on an armored door.
The lock that is installed at the door now is exactly like this one


I live in Greece so we usually replace this kind of locks with locks that a Europrofile cylinder can be installed on them.
The owner is a 85-90 years old man and asked me for the most secure Europrofile cylinder I could get him.
I'm mentioning the age because it has to be something easy to use.
I would buy an abloy protec2, which I trust a lot but because I use one and I know that getting the key out of it, is not as simple as with most cylinders, I'm thinking for alternatives.

Also an escutcheon from DiSec(BD200) will be installed to protect the cylinder.

Some high security cylinders, available in Greece:

-Abloy Protec2
-Dom Diamant
-Kaba experT
-Keso 4000s omega
-Cisa RS3s
-Mauer NW5


I think Dom Diamant is a bit overpriced for what it offers so from the rest above I'm leaning towards to Kaba expert.
Kaba expert is great but as long as I know it can be picked or bumped. I'm not worried about picking that much but bumping..?

Should I proceed with abloy protect2 and get the old man pissed of until he gets used to it or you guys think I should choose another cylinder?

Any suggestions are welcomed.

Thanks for your time,
George

[tomasfuk]

Take EVVA (MCS or 3KS) into consideration too.
The Abloy Protec may be difficult for an old man, and I have made a bad experience with durability of this cylinder in a security door with multipoint locking mechanism. The thumb bearings are too subtle.

http://www.evva.at/com/countries/distri ... greece/en/

[Loukanikidis]

Thanks for the quick response.

From my experience with the protect I got, I don't have the best opinion about its durability too. It's been a year and a half since I bought it and while it is functional it kinda gets stuck when I turn the key. It's just not as smooth as I think it should be.
I also have the Abloy on a door with multiple locking points.
I've heard only the best for the Protect from a lot of people and that made me think that mine could just be faulty or something.

About the EVVAs...I just contacted the EVVA dealer in Greece and unfortunately the MCS is way out of price range(280€+ 55€ for 2 extra keys that I need) so it's not an option.
The 3KS costs 200€+55 for 2 keys.
Very expensive too but can it be compared to Kaba expert or the Abloy protect?
Imagine that I can find both the Protect2 and the ExperT for 145€ max with 5 keys too.

[tomasfuk]

You can buy it from e-shop in Germany.
3KS+ double cylinder, modular 31/31 base price 95,-
2 keys more +19,12
length inside 46 mm +15,59
enhanced drill protection outside +32,05
subtotal 161,76 Eur
DHL postage approx. 20 Eur
total approx. 180 Eur

[Loukanikidis]

3KS looks great and from what I read its bump proof and very difficult to pick.
Unfortunately It will take ~10 working days to arrive and I only have a week at max to install the new lock.

I did have a look at some threads here and from what I read, the most secure cylinders are considered the ones that do not use springs and pins like most locks do.

But practically, does this means that high security locks which operate with pins and springs, like Kaba Expert, are vulnerable even to common burglars? I saw some videos in which Kaba expert was bumped in a few seconds. I've heard though that in such videos they may have modified the locks (like removing some pins, etc) but it's frustrating even to see it.

I know I'm repeating myself but the only locks that are available to me right now, are:

-Abloy protec2 (~140€ with 5 keys)
-Kaba experT (~125€ with 5 keys)
-Dom IX 6 SR (~110€ with 5 keys)
-Dom Diamant (it's way out of the buyer's price range(~250€, maybe I could get it for 210) but if you believe it does worth the extra money maybe the buyer can afford it.
-Mul-T-Lock MT5+ (~150€ with 5 keys)
-Mauer NW5 (same as MT5+)

From these locks above, which one would you get if you had not enough time to wait for something better(like the EVVAs) ?

[tomasfuk]

Depends on what escutcheon you have there.
The Abloy Protec for 140 Eur should be the version without drill protection, intended for interior use. The only drill protection is that the disc with keyhole rotates,...snip...
The version with hardened steel face costs at least 40 Eur more (for 1 side protected). Milling cutter for it is rare and costs cca the some money as the cylinder.

Edited to remove destructive entry information, otherwise this thread would have to be moved to advanced forums at this time. ~~GWiens2001~~

[Loukanikidis]

This is the escutcheon I will be using:
http://disec.it/Products2.aspx?catid=18&id=43
http://youtu.be/gsscdX1JTbU

Yes it's 140€ for the non hardened Abloy.
The hardened costs +25€ but I don't think I'm going to need it because of the escutcheon.

Even if someone here has the special milling tool that exists for the Abloy, I think he won't be able to use it because of the escutcheon.

[tomasfuk]

For the brass version you need no special expensive tool
Escutcheon looks fine, but I did not find any information on security class or certification there. Suspicious...

[Loukanikidis]

Great. I use the brass version without an escutcheon on an aluminum door.
At least there will be a way to open the door if for some reason I get locked outside and lose the key.

I think DiSec escutcheons are certified from Giordano Institute-not sure though.
After the Gemini Defender, some escutcheons from DiSec and Mottura are the most secure I've found for Europrofile cylinders. Also, they are way cheaper(40-100€ max) than the Gemini. Of course the Gemini is way better but I think they are decent for their price tag.