When it comes down to it there is nothing better than manual tools for your Lock pick Set, whether they be retail, homebrew, macgyver style. DIY'ers look here.
Ok, these aren't impressions per se, but for the sake of this thread, I'll count them as such. My girlfriend uses the same locks as in my previous posts inside her house.
Due to copying already copied copies of copied keys (get it? ) and to loss of some keys, replaced by others that barely work in the lock, and then copying them (the locks have around 20+ years), many of those keys don't work smoothly, or are only able to operate one turn of the lock. She asked me if I could fix that.
Me? Of course!
Today I worked in two keys, because she had removed the lock from the door (going to paint the doors) and I started by those, in case I wasn't sure of anything, I could "cheat" and look at the levers. Didn't need to.
First key I worked, I forgot to take pictures prior to filing it Anyway, here's the finished key, and I pointed out the place where I filed: Just thined that a little bit and voilá, working key!
The next one involved a little more work. Here's the key prior to impression:
First, I used a match to give the key a layer of soot, so I could see the impression marks a little better. Got this:
Notice that the center mark is a little off-centered? I believe it's because I'm inserting the key on one side of the lock. If I inserted on the other side, it would mark it symetrically. That's why these kind of keys are always symetrical.
So after a little filling I eventually got this:
At first, the key was working perfectly, but I didn't feel it as smooth as it should. That's when I cheated and looked at the levers while operating the key. I had to file this part just a little bit more on the side (on both sides actually):
I had seen those marks on the key with the soot, but wasn't sure what they meant so I didn't file to "thin" the teeth of the key. Now I know! I know this isn't a full impression, but produced a lot of help to "my quest"!
Questions: 1)
Notice that the center mark is a little off-centered? I believe it's because I'm inserting the key on one side of the lock. If I inserted on the other side, it would mark it symetrically. That's why these kind of keys are always symetrical.
Is this correct?
I'll work on the other keys and I'll post them here! One of them will actually have to be impressioned, as it's missing!
Thanks
Go ahead, keep plugging away, picking on me! You will end up on bypass or with rigor mortise. - GWiens2001
fgarci03 wrote:Just one question: 1) On this one, I noticed a lot of drag marks, haven't seen them on other impressions. Any idea what they could be?
Where you see this drag marks?
Sorry the delay, forgot this thread On the side of the blank, and sometimes on the edge. But they weren't too difficult to distinguish from the impressioning marks...
Go ahead, keep plugging away, picking on me! You will end up on bypass or with rigor mortise. - GWiens2001
My first pin tumbler impression! (Ok, not a real impression, but a key making ) A while ago, I got this Elzet 751 from ARF-GEF. It had no keys so I wanted to make a key for it. Here's the lock:
So, yesterday night, I disassembled it and looked for a key that fitted, with shallow cuts, so I could work from it:
They key fitted and all it's cuts made the pins stay above the sheerline. Perfect!
So I started filing down, and suddently on of the pins got REALLY under the sheerline. Couldn't understand why. Then I figured it out... The already cutted key's bitting didn't had the same spacing as this lock. So when I started trimming the sharp edges out of the key, so it fits smoothly on the lock, I was actually filling down where the pins were. So, ditched the key, and today went and grabbed a few blanks.
Start again! Pin by pin this time:
Until I got this key, and this sheerline:
Everything assembled, the key didn't work... Crap, remove the plug again... After all, all I needed was to file just a little more some of the pins, and it now works smoothly! Here's the key:
And the proof of success:
Nothing too great, but good enough for me!
Today I don't have questions (wow!), but a few notes: 1) I need to start being more carefull with the C-Clip, as it bent a little and now drags when the plug rotates. After a million turns it got smoother and isn't a problem, but it's something I'll watch out next time; 2) I was very carefull on my tryings to test if they key COULD BE REMOVED from the lock, by appling hard pressure on the pins and removing the key from the plug, before inserting the plug on the cylinder. I think it's worth a note, as I'm often distracted with other stuff. Had I not tested and trimmed the edges, I would have ruined this lock.
That's all for now
Go ahead, keep plugging away, picking on me! You will end up on bypass or with rigor mortise. - GWiens2001
Very good! . That key has a deep cut next to a shallow cut, so the ramp between the two has to be steep. It is wise to test for ability to insert and remove the key as you go.
Canyoning (filing with too steep a ramp) can cause the key to get stuck in the lock. This could be a real problem in an installed lock. If the lock is in your vice when that happens while impressioning, you can try removing the lock from the vice and tapping it sharply on a piece of wood on the side of the lock that holds the driver pins, while lightly pulling on the key. Most of the time if the ramp is not too steep yet you can make the key pins jump enough to remove the key. I usually Israel a rawhide mallet for this, but wood boards are more common.
When making keys by the method you used, I lightly press the plug from underneath so the blank aligns with the outer edge of the plug. That way I have fewer issues with finishing up and reassembling, only to have a non-functional key.
Most of the time, I make keys by impressioning. But this method was the way I first learned to make a key.
Keep up the good work, fgarci03
Gordon
Just when you finally think you have learned it all, that is when you learn that you don't know anything yet.
GWiens2001 wrote:When making keys by the method you used, I lightly press the plug from underneath so the blank aligns with the outer edge of the plug. That way I have fewer issues with finishing up and reassembling, only to have a non-functional key.
Exactly. I looked at the plug and all the pins were aligned. I did that and they sticked out just a hair so I filed just a little bit more and it worked. Lesson learned
Most of the time, I make keys by impressioning. But this method was the way I first learned to make a key.
Yeah I still have trouble with regular impressoning, so I did it this way. But that's my goal!
I usually use... Not usually Israel
I bet you use Swype Keyboard!
Go ahead, keep plugging away, picking on me! You will end up on bypass or with rigor mortise. - GWiens2001
Again, same method as before, but this time I marked all the edge with a sharpie first: (Now that I look at the pic, you don't really notice the black on the edge because of the flash!)
After that, I inserted the key on the empty plug, inserted the pins and pressed them. It gave nice impressioning marks:
After filing it with a round file I got this raw shape:
Used a flat file to smooth it all up:
NOTE: I didn't file with the round file ALL the way down on the first go. I left a hair sticking out on each pin, because smoothing things out with the flat file might actually file something on the key that wasn't supposed to. After that, tested again, and the pins that still needed filing got a last sweep.
This lock was interesting because of it's pins. Here's a key and a driver pin: Notice that both have a rounded tip. And being rounded, I suppose that on a real impression, it would make it very hard to see the marks.
Having rounded driver pins, this happens:
P.S. - I did this BTW. Nice advice! Worked at first time!
GWiens2001 wrote:When making keys by the method you used, I lightly press the plug from underneath so the blank aligns with the outer edge of the plug. That way I have fewer issues with finishing up and reassembling, only to have a non-functional key.
Go ahead, keep plugging away, picking on me! You will end up on bypass or with rigor mortise. - GWiens2001
Glad my advice worked. It had to be correct sometime.
Nice work on the key!
Yes, those rounded pins can be extremely difficult to read impressions with. Those take a bit to DI correctly, but you feel proud when you succeed in making a key. Most of the locks that lockies ask me to make a key for have those very round bottoms.
Keep up the good work, my friend!
Gordon
Just when you finally think you have learned it all, that is when you learn that you don't know anything yet.
So, I got a beautifull Corbin Masterring from Keymaster a couple of days ago. It came with 2 user keys, and he was kind enough to send me 3 blanks for my projects.
So I got to work! Disassembled the whole thing:
And got the pins out (note: the pins aren't in the order they go into the chamber. The masterpins come before the spools):
So I didn't make anything new, so I won't describe the process of the impression itself. Just gonna tell you how it went. I removed bothe plugs, got the pins out and started to think: "How the heck am I gonna put this back together again? I can't use a big plug follower because the follower won't fit the front of the lock."
So before anything else I made the key. Gonna show you the pic in a moment. After that, with Xeo's precious help, I got everything back together.
Basically I removed the top strip and loaded everything from there. But . That thing was tight. Was a PITA to remove. And way worse to put back again.
Anyway, after re-assembling everything, I remembered the lock had masterpins, so I could make other keys that operated the master ring. But I knew I wasn't gonna disassemble the whole thing again. So I did the math, and made another master key.
How I did that? I noticed that the first cut had to be the same on any key (I don't have pictures of that but it's how it goes. The 2nd and 3rd cut have master pins so I can play with them. The last 3 have to be the same on every master key. So I played with the 2nd and 3rd. Basically I made the 2nd master key with the first 3 cuts similar to the user key, and the last 3 similar to the first master key.
I did it without the plug removed, just by comparing to the already made keys. So it doesn't work very well and sometimes doesn't rotate. I guess I filled it a little too much. Anyway I got the job done and have 2 user keys and 2 different master keys.
I'm happy!
Here are the keys:
The top one is the 2nd master key, middle is the user and bottom is the 1st master key. These came out a bit ugly but oh well... I'm still learning
Note: Putting the top strip back was insanelly hard. I bent and rebent the CRAP out of the strip! I swear I could hear it say: "Stop... Please... No more... End-my-suffering... KILL MEEEE!"
It got pretty tight once I got it there. So, in the end, I managed to do something OK today!
Here's the proof:
Go ahead, keep plugging away, picking on me! You will end up on bypass or with rigor mortise. - GWiens2001
Nice job fgarci03! That is a really cool lock, Corbin Masterring. And kudos on getting that spring retainer back in; deffinately worth the effort, I'm sure! Keep it up, these are great posts and I am learning a lot from them.
Funny one. I got a Keymark from Jeff a while ago. Wanted a key for it. But no blanks available.
So let's get down to business! Got a street sweeper bristle and rounded the tip so it can slide through the pins:
Won't walk you up through the process, didn't do anything new. The only particularity with this lock is I had to screw the tail piece on the plug to make the "key" bump against it so I could work always on the same place.
After a while, inserted the plug in the lock and:
BANG! Opened!
Here's the "key":
So this one has something to it. I have to use a tension wrench to open the lock, as the bristle in to thin for the keyway and doesn't allow it to rotate it. Sometimes it needs a little wiggle to open, but with the amount of times I'm opening and closing it will soon fade out.
I know most of you have done even stranger things. But I need to say that when I bought my first pick set I sure wasn't imagining making a key out of a street sweeper bristle!
Go ahead, keep plugging away, picking on me! You will end up on bypass or with rigor mortise. - GWiens2001
) and to loss of some keys, replaced by others that barely work in the lock, and then copying them (the locks have around 20+ years), many of those keys don't work smoothly, or are only able to operate one turn of the lock. She asked me if I could fix that.
. That key has a deep cut next to a shallow cut, so the ramp between the two has to be steep. It is wise to test for ability to insert and remove the key as you go. 
