Evva keyway

by **mbell** » 14 Apr 2004 15:13

I've had two of these locks, keyed alike, for a while now. It's puzzling me how one would go about picking it. I cant get ANY of my picks to even fit in the keyway (including my home-made massively scaled down picks).

Anyone tried picking a lock with a keyway restricted in this way? If so, how?

by **Chucklz** » 14 Apr 2004 15:32

Ive never had to deal with anything that restrictive yet, but I've had a few come close. I made a hook style pick out of a dissecting needle. Basically its a rather large sewing needle mounted in a plastic handle. Not the best pick by any means, but very maneuverable in a lock.

by **Mad Mick** » 14 Apr 2004 16:10

Hmmm, tricky!
Thinking along the lines of Chucklz's idea, (and the 'sputnik key'), would a syringe needle - assuming it could be bent without kinking - with a wire inside be a possible tool for this restrictive keyway?

Any opinions?

by **mbell** » 14 Apr 2004 16:26

Nice Idea Mick. The major problem in my mind with that is the size of the wire - Wouldn't it have to be REALLY small, therefore perhaps not strong enough to lift the pins?

It makes me wonder why I've never seen keyways restricted like this before. All because of manufacturing costs I suppose.

Curiosity got the better of me and I took it apart. No spool/mushroom pins at all yet the build quality is amazing!

by **Varjeal** » 14 Apr 2004 16:28

That's definitely one of the nastiest restrive keyways I've seen in awhile...wonder if there's any spool pins in that lock tool. That probably is a registered restricted keyway....wow...I like the sewing needle idea. If you can get one bent into a decent hook that "should' be thin enough to reach the pins. :shock:

by **Mad Mick** » 14 Apr 2004 16:40

Was that 'dissecting', or 'syringe' needle? Hopefully, Chucklz may be the man to try making such a syringe needle contraption. :wink:

by **Chucklz** » 14 Apr 2004 17:06

It was a dissecting needle. But the syringe needle idea seems very interesting. I can see some issues that need to be worked out. First, syringe needles are made of very tough, stiff steel that will be hard to bend without kinking, but I will certainly try. The second problem is more of a supply problem. Most needles today are mounted in a little plastic adapter that mates with a syringe, so are not made for repeated use (thank god). But, I do have a few 60 year old metal needles in the lab, that would probably be excellent, so I dont know if many others could easily repeat anything I accomplish.

Anyone have any ideas for a good source of wire for this?

by **Mad Mick** » 14 Apr 2004 17:28

What's the I.D. of a typical syringe needle which would fit into a similarly restrictive keyway?

The idea is to create a graduated curve to 90 degrees (approx), then use the wire to manipulate the pins vertically. The wire should be thin enough to pass between the wards and into the pin chamber, unless the wards overlap which would direct the wire to the side of the keyway. In that case, this method is very unlikely to work.

I'm now thinking of some type of braided steel for the actual picking wire....possibly SS fishing terminal rig wire?

by **FuSL** » 14 Apr 2004 17:29

here in germany,
you come across locks with a keyway as restricted pretty often.
often even cheap locks have a pretty restricted one, though not that restrictive.. I can't get my picks inside, maybe I'll order some slimline ones, hoping they'll fit.. .]

by **Chucklz** » 14 Apr 2004 17:32

There are many different gagues (OD and presumably ID) of syringe needles available. I have to poke around (bad pun i know) tomorrow and see what fits nicely in locks.

But for now, what does everyone think of these Biopsy needles as an almost complete product?
http://www.surgical911.com/cgi-bin/dbex ... e=0&Ftext=

by **Mad Mick** » 14 Apr 2004 17:33

First, syringe needles are made of very tough, stiff steel that will be hard to bend without kinking, but I will certainly try.

If you know how a plumber bends tube without kinks, then you can probably bend a syringe needle. He uses a flexible insert inside the tube which supports the walls as the tube is bent, but is allowed to be removed after the operation is performed. You already know this, but WTH.

by **mbell** » 14 Apr 2004 17:41

Thanks for the posts so far. I'm in no position to make any such tool myself - I've only ever seen needles a couple of times in hospitals. Let me know if you have any success.

As I mentioned earlier, the wire must be REALLY thin yet have an immense strength/rigidness to lift the pins.

by **Mad Mick** » 14 Apr 2004 17:43

Wow, kinda expensive as a project, but if there are some samples available, knowing the I.D. would determine the braid to be used.

The best way I can think of for forming the bend, would be to find the closest match for the I.D. then use the next size down braid. This should allow for removal afterwards, then use the next size down again for the actual picking braid. Assuming braid is the best solution - I imagine wire to have more of a memory.

by **mbell** » 14 Apr 2004 17:47

OK, the inner measurements of the needles are quite a bit bigger than I thought.

by **Darek84CJ** » 14 Apr 2004 17:49

Makes me cringe just looking at it.

Evva keyway

Evva keyway

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