Tension troubles

[Solomon]

Hey everyone, this is my first post here but I've been interested in how locks work for a good while now. I'm having a bit of a dilemma when it comes to applying tension and would like some opinions because I can't make my mind up. I got a set of picks from southord aswell as one of those brockhage practice locks, housed in transparent plastic. I can see exactly what's going on inside as I work and am now able to do it without looking, which is neat. However, when I apply light tension I can't seem to get good feedback from the pins.

I know the idea of applying the lightest tension necessary is to feel the rotation of the plug as the gap between the key and driver pins reaches the shear line... but for some reason I find this awkward. Maybe it's because I'm not applying a uniform enough torque, I dunno. But it seems that if I'm using more tension I can find the binding pin easier... instead of the plug rotating as it clicks into place, I can feel a little friction as I push the pin upwards, like a stiffness. The rest of the pins feel springy, but the binding pin gives me that slightly stiff feeling as I move it, so I reduce the tension a tiny bit to make it easier to move into place and once that's done I up the tension again until I find the next binding pin. This works just fine when I'm using the practice lock in my hand, but when it comes to a mounted lock it just doesn't seem to work. For the record though, the other lock I am attempting to pick is an ISEO and it is mounted with the pins at the bottom of the keyway. I don't think that makes a difference, but I noticed that the ISEO has much stiffer springs and that could mean the tip of the pick is slipping off the pins as I push them down. That being said, the way I'm holding the pick should avoid that happening... right? The tip of my finger is resting against the plug and I work from the back of the lock, moving back a tiny bit at a time and keeping the fingertip against the plug. Here's a pic to show what I mean.

So, questions... what do you guys think of the technique I'm using? I know everyone has their own style, but is there anything particularly wrong with how I'm doing it? I think the reason I'm having trouble with the ISEO is because I can't actually tell when the tip of the pick is directly on top of a pin. This means I'm not sure if I'm pushing the pins far enough to actually let the gap between the key and driver pins pass the shear line, and as you can imagine that's pretty problematic. I'm still working on my technique though so I'm sure I'll get the feel for it... also, could the springs being tighter be what's throwing me off or should that actually help? The only other thing I'm thinking is, by starting at the back of the lock each time and moving back a tiny bit at a time over the pins, could that actually be oversetting them as I go back over them again?

Thanks a million guys, looking forward to learning here!

[barbarian]

I'm not sure I can offer any help, but I will start the ball rolling. Your technique sounds good, it seems like you are understanding everything quite well. I will say that if a bit more tension on this lock helps you and you can feel the pins set like you say, then go for it. You will find that each lock is a bit different, maybe this one needs a bit more tension.

Having a lock in hand is nicer because you get to change the angle just the way you want it, and you also get some feedback from the holding hand. Once the thing is mounted, you lose some of that.

[datagram]

One important thing to remember is that there is no universal amount of tension. For each lock you should probe when you begin (if it is a challenging lock) to determine the proper range of allowable tension. Begin by using just the pick and lifting all pins stans together, this gives you a feel for the average spring pressure. If you are going after a lock that uses variable tension springs you'll want to examine each individually and make note of it mentally or with a notepad. Then, list all pins, apply high tension, and remove the pick. See if any fall down. Keep doing this until you get a good feel for the lower bounds of "too much" tension. After that, attempt extremely minimal tension and see if you can get any components to bind. After doing this you'll have a much better understanding of the proper tension requirements for the lock, and in many cases you can even determine binding order or proper height of a few pins while doing these probes.

Something else that might help is a top tension wrench, rather than bottom, especially because from the photo it looks like you're European and picking euro profile locks (upside-down locks, we say here ). Take a normal tension wrench and bend the opposite end to a small wrench, just 2/8 of an inch or so. Use this to tension off the top of the key (where the pins are), but take care not to bind the wrench against the first pin. Tensioning like this gives you more room to work, and provides tension that is better distributed within the lock.

Good luck!

dg

[Solomon]

Cheers DG! That makes a lot of sense, I'll have a go at that. About the tension wrenches I have, there are 2 - one is a twistflex, the other one is shorter and the bit which goes into the keyway is narrower so I can actually put that in the top to give me far more room to work. I know what you're saying though, putting it in the bottom is a lot comfier so I might mod one of them so I can do that.

[Solomon]

I finally got it! Spent about an hour but I got it... then I did it a second time, and it only took like 10 mins.



Take that, lock.

[Jaakko]

Do NOT pick locks that are in use! You may break them or damage them enough to make them failure at some point, so purchase separate locks for your new hobby, as I'm sure you appreciate working door lock and the fact that it opens only with the correct key...

[Squelchtone]

Jaakko is right, if you depend on that lock, one of our most important locksport rules is that we do not pick a lock that we rely on or one that is installed in a door. Even if the lock does not get stuck or break, there is a change your picks will break off inside and then you can't use that lock to get out of the building in an emergency, and you can no longer use it to secure your house, valuables, or familiy.

visit your local locksmith and buy a lock at a local store or online on ebay.

Squelchtone

[Solomon]

Sounds like a plan; I'll pick up a couple of locks next time I'm in town. I know picking a lock repeatedly can damage it over time, so I wasn't planning to practice on that lock regularly or anything. Just wanted to see if I could do it, and I can, so I'm happy now.

[thecrazy]

I finally got it! Spent about an hour but I got it... then I did it a second time, and it only took like 10 mins.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v205/ ... picked.jpg

Take that, lock.

This is the configurations of iseo lock

[Solomon]

This is the configurations of iseo lock

Holy crap, so do ISEO locks mostly contain spool pins then? That'd definately explain why it was so awkward.

[thecrazy]

I picked two of them but my videos are in spanish. Sorry guys

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QgUuJyy2xYk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IYX2BjD8pH4

[savs2k]

ah the tension topic again =P. Every lock and every person is different. When I first got interested in picking a few years ago, I remember using ALOT of tension. It worked soso since the picks I made back then were good for raking. Over time I found that practicing with more tension just got my hand tired faster so I decided to go for a new aproach and go as light as possibly and work my way up to a little more tension. It worked out really well for me that way. Im not that big of a guy but I work on cars all day and all night so my "light" tension is probably comparable to everyone else's too much. Im not that strong of a guy but using my fingers to screw in bolts all day, my fingers are stronger then most peoples. Your technique and understanding locks in general are pretty sound so all I can really say is go with as light as a touch as you can on a lock that you have opened before. let go of the tension wrench and hear for the pins to come back up. If you don't hear anything give a bit more tension. You'll start to notice whats the min amount of tension needed. Alot of people here can give you input but honestly I feel like the "tension" topic is one of those things you just need to figure out on your own. Congrats on getting the lock open and keep practicing!

p.s. I agree that you shouldn't pick locks you are still using. But at the same time it also depends on the door. I found that I'm more calm and careful playing with locks I need rather then extra locks I need. My theory behind this is that when you first start off practicing, If you can't get the lock open after a while you get aggravated and get sloppy. When I started I picked my bathroom door locks and my room lock. BUT NEVER THE FRONT OR BACK DOOR LOCKS!

[5thcorps]

I know exactly what u are saying about using high tension. Occasionally to really feel a binding pin i'll have my wrench bent quite ways until I can feel which is binding. Usually after the first light tension easily finishes the job.