Dear Locksmiths

[dmcintyre86]

How about a general section for boring, dumb old stories. People can learn from dumb things that happen to others

i really like this idea!!

[billdeserthills]

Just had another thought. What about a pricing section where we could discuss pricing. Locksmiths are always trying to determine a fair price so that we neither over charge our customer but at the same time don't undercut everyone else and get a reputation as a lowballer, nor give our services and knowledge away.

For example I went and installed a CDX-10 on a door at a defense contractorand am not sure what a fair price should have been. Kaba has no reference. Plus in this case there was all sorts of government and corporate hoops in place to jump through, had to have a background check, photo IDs made up, fingerprints taken, escorted at all times, tool bags checked on way in and out, hard hats, safety glasses, hi vis vests, steel-toed shoes, gloves, ear protection.

Mechanics have a flat rate manual where every little thing is broken down for pricing, we haven't got a similar guide AFAIK. We have the Ledger annual price guide but that's it.

Actually the National Locksmith does sell a Flat-Rate manual. I don't personally like the amounts of time they have set aside for some functions, so I make up my own pricing. Also if their book has not been revised it is from somewhere near two decades ago, which would leave out a lot of essential information.

[HeadHunterCEO]

Section dealing solely with life safety and ADA compliance.

[globallockytoo]

Section dealing solely with life safety and ADA compliance.

And building codes and their interpretations, the different ways local AHJ's look at the codes and their interpretations and modifications to suit local environments/applications.

[C locked]

Firstly the periods. yes i am on a phone.
i agree. A forum/sub forum with updates to regulations and disability compliance.
i hope we can Make this forum 'The' place for all current information that members who are working in the industry within our picking community need to know.

[globallockytoo]

Just had another thought. What about a pricing section where we could discuss pricing. Locksmiths are always trying to determine a fair price so that we neither over charge our customer but at the same time don't undercut everyone else and get a reputation as a lowballer, nor give our services and knowledge away.

For example I went and installed a CDX-10 on a door at a defense contractorand am not sure what a fair price should have been. Kaba has no reference. Plus in this case there was all sorts of government and corporate hoops in place to jump through, had to have a background check, photo IDs made up, fingerprints taken, escorted at all times, tool bags checked on way in and out, hard hats, safety glasses, hi vis vests, steel-toed shoes, gloves, ear protection.

Mechanics have a flat rate manual where every little thing is broken down for pricing, we haven't got a similar guide AFAIK. We have the Ledger annual price guide but that's it.

discussion of pricing among locksmith businesses might be worthwhile, however different cities have different economies of scale. Living in one city should not be used to compare to another cities prices.

What is charged in Orlando is most likely very different to what is charged in St Louis, for example. multiple reasons could include, % unemployment, average age of residents, utilities prices, milk, gasoline etc etc. All businesses need to base their prices on their cost and desired profit and not on prices elsewhere.

[1mrchristopher]

discussion of pricing among locksmith businesses might be worthwhile, however different cities have different economies of scale. Living in one city should not be used to compare to another cities prices.

What is charged in Orlando is most likely very different to what is charged in St Louis, for example. multiple reasons could include, % unemployment, average age of residents, utilities prices, milk, gasoline etc etc. All businesses need to base their prices on their cost and desired profit and not on prices elsewhere.

While it's true that the number are going to vary by location, it would be very interesting to know what services are going for in different areas. I am also intrigued by different locksmith's approaches to pricing: For instance, I've seen some that charge a high service call, and relatively low service costs, and then some that charge a low service call, and relatively high service costs.

[globallockytoo]

Pricing is varied by your location and how much you need to break even.

Essentially, work out your raw costs to break even/1 year and then double that amount to realize a fair profit.

I charge $30 to attend site and a minimum of 1 hour labor @$60 on site. So that means $90 for the first hour plus parts. (but my raw cost/break even point is $30/hour)

I believe that fair value pricing (for me) is $1.00 per minute labor and the attendance fee.

After the first hour it is usually billed in increments of 30 minutes.

[Squelchtone]

Thank you for all of your ideas everyone, I hope to find some spare time this weekend and create the sub forums that meet your needs. I may not implement every single idea, or may merge a couple into one main category, but I think you'll the end result.

Have a good week everybody,
Squelchtone

On my, where does the time go. I wrote that back in June and here we are in October. Forum improvements are always on my mind, and I hope to have some down time to implement your suggestions in the coming weeks. If anyone has come up with any other good ideas or wants/needs since this thread was started, I welcome your input.

Thanks, and thanks for being part of this community,
Squelchtone

[smokingman]

I don't think it is the number of posts per se but the content as well.
Contributing helpful knowledge is important to keep the balance.
It would not be fair to have four or five people supplying the rest
with their time and skills/knowledge that they have invested
many years of their life to aquire and get nought in return for their efforts.
The forum would not grow,but become a stagnant pool of resource for the lazy.
Quid pro quo.
But I digress,that's only my opinion .
Sorry to stray,back to the topic at hand.

[Sinifar]

Jay does a pretty good job of policing ClearStar. Having said that - to join you need to be usually a member of ALOA or SAVTA. This is pretty much on open forum, even the "advanced" forums only require 30 posts or so to join. Having said that --

IF you are going to have a smith only forum, then require credentials to get on it, much like ClearStar. One of above or a local license, where applicable, would be a requirement. If nothing else, proof of being in the business via a tax number, or some other form of acceptable proof that one is in the trade. ANY one of which should be okay.

AS far as hidden, it should be, and not show up until one logs in. Then have much like ClearStar, a general have it it forum, a commercial lock / high security forum, a safe and vault forum to discuss problems with that, an automotive forum for professionals to discuss problems they have run into and talk openly and plainly about that subject, and perhaps just a forum for getting the air out of a problem and letting smiths vent all they want about stuff which really irked them off. A non-lock forum as it was.

Just a suggestion.

Sinifar

[Squelchtone]

Jay does a pretty good job of policing ClearStar. Having said that - to join you need to be usually a member of ALOA or SAVTA. This is pretty much on open forum, even the "advanced" forums only require 30 posts or so to join. Having said that --

IF you are going to have a smith only forum, then require credentials to get on it, much like ClearStar. One of above or a local license, where applicable, would be a requirement. If nothing else, proof of being in the business via a tax number, or some other form of acceptable proof that one is in the trade. ANY one of which should be okay.

AS far as hidden, it should be, and not show up until one logs in. Then have much like ClearStar, a general have it it forum, a commercial lock / high security forum, a safe and vault forum to discuss problems with that, an automotive forum for professionals to discuss problems they have run into and talk openly and plainly about that subject, and perhaps just a forum for getting the air out of a problem and letting smiths vent all they want about stuff which really irked them off. A non-lock forum as it was.

Just a suggestion.

Sinifar

If I were to do all of that, then we might as well do what we were going to years ago and actually have a totally separate forum at Locksmiths101.com which you can still link to in the blue Locksmith link up top, but the idea behind a sub forum just for Locksmiths was to have a place to talk about suppliers, every day shop related stuff, customer stories, pro tips on how to mortise out a door, and what works for advertising, types of van you drive and tips for any new locksmiths just starting their business. I wasn't really envisioning a place where I have to sit on the phone half the day verifying people's TAX IDs and ALOA memberships, I simply don't have the time and it isnt the main focus of the forum. I just want Locksmiths to have their own corner hang out where n00bs and civilians arent hijacking threads and derailing topics, and since there are some topics that come up a lot, having a section for them works better than having them be in a thread. I also don't think I can allow all out discussion of things like safe drill points, door linkage locations and diagrams, or how to drill the newest vending machine you may come across on the job. That info is going to remain in the Advanced Topics area and Locksmiths are of course welcome to become members there and can talk shop in there as well.

Squelchtone

[Squelchtone]

So, I forgot the most important question for all of you..

What would you like to name your new area on the forum? right now I have it set as the existing name Locksmith Business Information, which is a bit formal sounding. Does anyone like any of these?

Locksmith Lounge
Locksmith Corner
Locksmith Pub
Locksmith Workbench
Locksmiths helping Locksmiths
Locksmith Chat
Locksmith Shop
Locksmith Area
Locksmith Guild
Locksmith Forum
Locksmith Village
Locksmiths Only!

Thanks for your ideas,
Squelchtone

[billdeserthills]

Jay does a pretty good job of policing ClearStar. Having said that - to join you need to be usually a member of ALOA or SAVTA. This is pretty much on open forum, even the "advanced" forums only require 30 posts or so to join. Having said that --

IF you are going to have a smith only forum, then require credentials to get on it, much like ClearStar. One of above or a local license, where applicable, would be a requirement. If nothing else, proof of being in the business via a tax number, or some other form of acceptable proof that one is in the trade. ANY one of which should be okay.

AS far as hidden, it should be, and not show up until one logs in. Then have much like ClearStar, a general have it it forum, a commercial lock / high security forum, a safe and vault forum to discuss problems with that, an automotive forum for professionals to discuss problems they have run into and talk openly and plainly about that subject, and perhaps just a forum for getting the air out of a problem and letting smiths vent all they want about stuff which really irked them off. A non-lock forum as it was.

Just a suggestion.

Sinifar

If I were to do all of that, then we might as well do what we were going to years ago and actually have a totally separate forum at Locksmiths101.com which you can still link to in the blue Locksmith link up top, but the idea behind a sub forum just for Locksmiths was to have a place to talk about suppliers, every day shop related stuff, customer stories, pro tips on how to mortise out a door, and what works for advertising, types of van you drive and tips for any new locksmiths just starting their business. I wasn't really envisioning a place where I have to sit on the phone half the day verifying people's TAX IDs and ALOA memberships, I simply don't have the time and it isnt the main focus of the forum. I just want Locksmiths to have their own corner hang out where n00bs and civilians arent hijacking threads and derailing topics, and since there are some topics that come up a lot, having a section for them works better than having them be in a thread. I also don't think I can allow all out discussion of things like safe drill points, door linkage locations and diagrams, or how to drill the newest vending machine you may come across on the job. That info is going to remain in the Advanced Topics area and Locksmiths are of course welcome to become members there and can talk shop in there as well.

Squelchtone

I must say, You make joining the advanced area sound easy, when in my experience it is anything but.
While it's true that I may not have been the nicest member to join up here, I feel I have done my part in helping
folks who may wish to get a start as a locksmith. It has been very frustrating in the past for me to come up with
answers for folks wishing help, only to be told that my answer is now in a place where neither I, or the person looking for
help can see it. Far as noobs hijacking threads goes, sometimes good ideas can come out of a person who isn't constrained
by an industry standard, anyhow any truely valuable topic will find itself back on it's path before long.

[Squelchtone]

I must say, You make joining the advanced area sound easy, when in my experience it is anything but.
While it's true that I may not have been the nicest member to join up here, I feel I have done my part in helping
folks who may wish to get a start as a locksmith. It has been very frustrating in the past for me to come up with
answers for folks wishing help, only to be told that my answer is now in a place where neither I, or the person looking for
help can see it. Far as noobs hijacking threads goes, sometimes good ideas can come out of a person who isn't constrained
by an industry standard, anyhow any truely valuable topic will find itself back on it's path before long.

I hear what you're saying man. You're still on the list for voting that will occur soon, and as you may know, we couldn't in good conscience let a user into Advanced just after they got banned for a month, so yes, you had a rough start, but the delay in getting in has been justified while the admins and moderators discussed it and decided it wasn't the right time yet. We do appreciate your experience and contributions and are happy that you're getting settled in.

Squelchtone