Needing Apprenticeship Help...

[paganpicker]

I really wish to work with a Master Locksmith to cut my learning curb here. Any advice on approaching an established locksmith to apprentice under him? Any and all advice is greatly appreciated, thanks in advance.

thing is I don't just wish to learn to pick locks, I want to open my own business one day soon so I wish to learn everything I can about locksmithing. With this in mind, working under an experienced professional rather than stumbling along on my own would be invaluable.

[billdeserthills]

Yep, without a doubt reading your post reminds me why I quit taking on apprentices at my shop. That would be all I need, to train someone in my shop who can't wait
to steal my clients or set up a competing business in my town...No thanks

[Squelchtone]

Yep, without a doubt reading your post reminds me why I quit taking on apprentices at my shop. That would be all I need, to train someone in my shop who can't wait
to steal my clients or set up a competing business in my town...No thanks

Good thing he doesn't live in your town Billdeserthills. it seems you think everyone is out to get you, be it ex customers, vendors, manufacturers, or them Mexicans, Jews, and Muslims.. you sometimes sound like you belong on an episode of Archie Bunker circa 1980.

I already emailed someone else on the forum this morning about not being such a negative old crank.. if you don't have something helpful or positive to say, just don't say it.. or find a nicer way of telling the OP that locksmiths are protective types and will assume someone new asking about the trade is looking to start a business which they will see as competition.

I've had a lot of folks in the last few months tell me they left lp101 and went elsewhere because established members here giving them grief and being rude. We need to change that attitude and that reputation. I know that I give members grief sometimes and even delete or lock threads but as an admin I have to administer the law from time to time, but I expect members being helpful and nice to other members, especially to new ones.

Things better change, or I'm going to be asking folks to not bother posting or we'll just ban a handful of bad apples so the rest of the forum doesn't have to deal with them.

Squelchtone

[billdeserthills]

I really wish to work with a Master Locksmith to cut my learning curb here. Any advice on approaching an established locksmith to apprentice under him? Any and all advice is greatly appreciated, thanks in advance.

thing is I don't just wish to learn to pick locks, I want to open my own business one day soon so I wish to learn everything I can about locksmithing. With this in mind, working under an experienced professional rather than stumbling along on my own would be invaluable.

Fine, I will take another try at this,
Paganpicker, it is true, that locksmiths are a fairly paranoid lot of people. That being said, most of us don't mind helping out a newby if he is outside our immediate area. One thing I have found is being self-employed
successfully really takes a special type of person. You Must be a Self-Starter, you will need to have what it takes to grab an opportunity by the horns, so to speak, as you likely already know, finding someone to help is not usually going to be possible. I know if You desire to learn there are places to do so, lots of really good information can be found on this forum especially. One nice thing about locksmithing currently is the trend that introducing transponder keys has caused, which is that locksmiths are branching off in different directions. That is, more and more folks are beginning to specialize in one or more types of locksmithing. Personally I don't have the tools to program transponder keys and yet turning away that business has not caused my business to falter. I continue to do light commercial and residential lock work, which is largely unchanged from the way it has been done since pre 1970. That is not to say it is easy or unchallenging work, I find impressioning keys, and masterkeying locks to be the same challenge I first loved 25+ years ago, when my Dad first allowed me to teach myself through the frustration of working with him. He always had the idea that if I watched him do something I could learn it & I had a real problem with that. You cannot see the amount of tension required to turn a lock cylinder while picking it open, just like you cannot see how tight a deadbolt needs to have it's screws fastened to stay in it's proper place on a door. Some folks have a penchant for doing this work and others have to really want to succeed in order to win. I had to really want to win, because my Dad spent most of his free time knocking me down with his comments. He was correct, I wasn't really applying myself, as the newness and fun of becoming a locksmith had all worn off after 4+ years of apprenticeship with a guy who could have been in Mensa, had he desired to fill out the application--Working with people like that is not the easiest thing.

One great thing on Your side nowadays is the internet. You can get yourself an internet presence and it doesn't hafta cost a lot of money. Most folks in Your situation can actually already do some simple locksmithing work, for example I bet You can rekey at least some house locks, if You had a pin kit and a key machine You could begin to live Your dream very soon! A client will simply e-mail or call you, you pick the time when You can go out and do the rekeying job. It doesn't take much to teach yourself how to drill the mounting holes in a 2x4 and learn to chisel or mortise in the latch and strike hardware & before long You will have what You need to install new locks added to your bag of tricks. All I really meant with my former comment is I think You will be miles ahead if You can find a way to learn on your own, that way You are not dependant upon other folks to help you & that is Gold!

[hag3l3]

hello, i must apologize for Billdeserthills manners, the vast majority of us locksmiths are not so cynical as him.
first and foremost, welcome to the site, glad you found it. Second, allow myself to steer you in a better direction.
I personally have no issue with training anyone who shows an interest or desire to join the ranks of fellow locksmiths. As we are currently in short supply ( the professional non cranky legitimate ones). should happenstance allow someone such as you to be in a future position to open a busines, well then i say congrats to you, knowing that under my tutelage you will have learned the necessary skills to professionally assist your customers in a manner to actually lift up our business in the eyes of the public sector. i see no loss of customer base here. i only see a well educated and informed professional added to the ranks. now, allow me to give you a little advice as to HOW to properly broach the subject of learning. if you just walk into a locksmith shop and say "hey man, what do i gotta do to learn what you know?" the absolute first response you will receive will be what billdeserthills said. this is an ordinary response.
you have to understand, we do not know who you are, what your intentions for learning might be. so the best way to broach this particular subject with a locksmith in your area would be to show them your character. for it is character, and ethical fortitude that will endear you to the ranks more than anything. We have an old, unwritten saying in the Culinary world i think might help you here: as i was a professional Chef for 15 years prior i can vouch safe for this. " it is far easier to teach a peasant from the streets than it is to teach a new academian from the kitchen of Escoffier"
it is your approach that you need to work on, show you are of good character, show you have a true desire to LEARN, not just to seek knowledge. also, show some restraint and empathy for this field. be aware that what you are asking of someone else is to teach you security in a field overburdened already with too many individuals who have questionable motives. be willing to start very small, and you will find that AFTER A TIME- you will start to learn. hope this helps......

[2octops]

I know a lot of locksmiths with the attitude that they refuse to hire anyone because they are afraid they will be training their own competition. That's a pizz poor attitude for any business owner to have and generally the ones with that attitude are their own largest competition.

When searching for a valuable employee we generally look for 2 things. One is a excellent locksmith and the other is an excellent business person. It is very rare that we ever run across a person that has both skills.

I've hired a lot of people over the years. Some had absolutely no experience and some had been locksmiths longer than I have been alive. They each have their place in this industry.

The experienced locksmiths can be put in a van, given a phone and let them go make money instantly. These folks usually enjoy the work but have no desire to actually run a business, even though many have done so in the past. These people are invaluable to a successful business.

The folks that know absolutely nothing are just as invaluable if not more. They have a desire to learn something. They are driven to please the business owner, almost like a little puppy, because they hope to succeed and keep their job. They learn to do things the way they are taught and typically do not have the lifelong bad habits that experienced people have.

The best advise I can offer is to find a brick and mortar shop, walk in and ask if you can fill out an application. Don't start out describing your abilities to be able to pick a lock. Start out by describing your desire for a job and your desire to learn more about the business. Being able to pick a lock is a little bit of a bonus but not enough to land you a job since it is an extremely small part of our work. Don't be offended if you are started out as a shop flunky that has to sweep up, take out the trash, clean the bathroom and organize inventory. These are all very important parts of running a business. If you accept that and do well, then in your spare time you will likely be showed other tasks that are a little more lock related such as cutting keys, rekeying cylinders and fitting keys to locks. You might even get to start going out on jobs with techs to carry tools and hardware before long. If so, do it while watching and learning how the tech performs each job and how they select the tools and hardware needed for each work order of the day.

You will learn quickly by watching how the shop operates and how the road techs work if you want to work as a locksmith or actually run a business. Many times people simply end up wanting to be a locksmith and have no desire to deal with the headaches and struggles of running the actual business.

It's not a bad gig if you can get it.

[victorylocksmith]

i for one have to say Billdeserthills is the man, he is one of the main reasons why i stay on this website. believe me, i was a class A schmuck locksmith for a long time and to some extent still am. however, i was always hungry to learn and learned most of what i know on my own and from sound advice from those such as Bill. bill is a cynical guy but hey, most of us locksmiths are a bit off. we are not always the friendliest or most socially adjusted people. i myself have trained myself to be very personable in front of my clients even though in actual everyday life i can be quite an butthole.

bill was one of the many people who lifted me up after my ex dumped me for some other butthole and i lost my job at a great locksmith job. he was the guy who recently gave me advice on doing safe work when my inept ass had no idea what to do.

if you are serious about becoming a locksmith, i will give you advice that is not the traditional, go on the internet to advertise and learn the trade, my advice is something very different. first and foremost you have to be personable with clients and build rapport, there were many moments where i had no idea what i was doing but eventually i figured things out and the clients loved me. of course i didnt tell them that i had no idea what i was doing but my point is this, "no one cares how much you know, until they know how much you care." gain their trust and you will earn their continued business and that of their close ones. also, it is imperative to build strong relationships with dealers and suppliers, i scored a brand new baldwin mortise body with a spindle, today. all because i was personable on the phone and have good relationships with my suppliers.

lastly, i would like to end on this, bill is a man much like myself. although he may sound like an butthole and probably acts like an butthole as well, the man has a good heart and he ultimately is trying to be a good man which is a whole lot better than most of the conmen Israeli mafia scam scum out there.

[victorylocksmith]

i for one have to say Billdeserthills is the man, he is one of the main reasons why i stay on this website. believe me, i was a class A schmuck locksmith for a long time and to some extent still am. however, i was always hungry to learn and learned most of what i know on my own and from sound advice from those such as Bill. bill is a cynical guy but hey, most of us locksmiths are a bit off. we are not always the friendliest or most socially adjusted people. i myself have trained myself to be very personable in front of my clients even though in actual everyday life i can be quite an butthole.

bill was one of the many people who lifted me up after my ex dumped me for some other butthole and i lost my job at a great locksmith job. he was the guy who recently gave me advice on doing safe work when my inept ass had no idea what to do.

if you are serious about becoming a locksmith, i will give you advice that is not the traditional, go on the internet to advertise and learn the trade, my advice is something very different. first and foremost you have to be personable with clients and build rapport, there were many moments where i had no idea what i was doing but eventually i figured things out and the clients loved me. of course i didnt tell them that i had no idea what i was doing but my point is this, "no one cares how much you know, until they know how much you care." gain their trust and you will earn their continued business and that of their close ones. also, it is imperative to build strong relationships with dealers and suppliers, i scored a brand new baldwin mortise body with a spindle, today. all because i was personable on the phone and have good relationships with my suppliers.

lastly, i would like to end on this, bill is a man much like myself. although he may sound like an butthole and probably acts like an butthole as well, the man has a good heart and he ultimately is trying to be a good man which is a whole lot better than most of the conmen Israeli mafia scam scum <censored> out there.

at the end of the day, businessowners and locksmiths want to make money. if you display great communication skills and the pre-emptive to build relationships with clients and suppliers as well as display a reasonable amount of technical knowledge about locks. there will be no reason for anyone not to hire you. success wont come easy or instantly but you have to sell yourself, and like any good salesman knows, no only means you havent built enough value for them to say yes yet (no just means they havent said yes yet)

[cledry]

We love to hire people with little or no training. What we don't like to hire are people who can pick a lock and think they are ready to make top dollar as a locksmith. Picking is a good skill to have, but in the trade it is a very small part of what we do, and we cannot afford to spend much time picking a lock. If you have taken an online course that isn't really an advantage at least not with us. We usually have to retrain those basic skills anyway.

I am glad a locksmith took a chance on me long ago; I with no skills other than a good brain, mechanical ability, and a good work ethic.

[cledry]

Another thing we look for is stability in former jobs and perhaps signs that you moved up in a previous job.

We had a load of applicants last week and going through their CVs there were a couple of potentials that were binned simply because they spent a month in this job, 6 months in that etc. Some that were "locksmiths" were binned because of poor job stability.

A CV that made the possibles pile is a chap who worked at Walgreens Drug store, he started as a clerk and worked his way up to manager of the photo dept. over a period of 3 years. No experience but a good work ethic.

[billdeserthills]

Actually the last person I hired was responsible for putting me fooey on employees. The guys resume looked OK, his last job had been as vice president in a bank and when I called they said he had a No Rehire status.
I couldn't really find any reason not to hire him and the fact that he had never worked on anything even close to locksmithing seemed a good thing, as I wouldn't need to un-teach any bad habits. He was an older gentleman which made me think he wasn't gonna be in a hurry to just rush off in the next 6 months to a year, like most of the young people I have hired and trained. So anyhow I hired the guy, things seemed to go fine, and he always showed up on time. He even seemed to gain a very quick grasp of the common keys and where to find them on the racks. Then one day a customer brought back a key, saying it wouldn't work in their lock. I carefully looked the key over and realized It was cut Upside down! He had placed the client's key in the machine properly, but had placed the blank in the machine upside down...Anyhow as summer went on I discovered why his last job had him on a No Rehire status, he was over 85% Blind! I spent the rest of my summer doing free service calls, cause how could I charge anything once I found out that he had cut a non-working
key? The whole thing cost me hundreds, if not thousands, in call-backs and free work, which was minimal but time consuming nevertheless. I had never even considered the possibility that a mostly blind dude would fill out an application, and I had zero idea how to get rid of the guy, without getting my butt sued. Fortunately for me his Mom took ill and he decided he wanted to help make her better. I was never in my life happier to have someone up & quit on me before!

[tomcat]

Hey Rev! I have contacts in SC and can possibly direct you to some folks to talk with. You may want to explore participating in the local associations either in SC or NC. The SOPL often hosts live online webinars which also may be helpful. Shoot me a PM if you still need some support. Good Luck!

[Tyler J. Thomas]

The SCLA (South Carolina Locksmith Association) hosts 4 meetings a year with classes at all of them. I'm sure if you spoke with Jean and explained your situation, they'd at least hear you out and might even let you join (they are very well ran). Basic locksmithing, access control, safe work, etc. They cover it all. Usually hold their meetings outside of Greenville, IIRC.

They are very well attended - the last one I attended had at least 40 people (they under-booked the room and it was standing room only). In other words, you'll have plenty of chances to network with business owners or employees who can put you in touch with their business owner.

[Pintickler]

Hey, Rev, if there is a Pop a Lock franchise in your area you may be in luck. Don't know where you are in South Carolina but I know Charleston has a franchise. If you went to work for them you could learn to be a good locksmith at your own pace. You would be unlocking cars right away, but probably also doing roadside tire changes and jumpstarts, which pass the time nicely and put a little money in your pocket while you teach yourself how to make keys for cars and other cool locksmithy stuff.