Working on a 5/6 pin cylindar

[Josh K]

I bought a nice set of picks (Southord, can't remember how many) and have been experimenting with them on a number of padlocks. I managed to rake open my cylindrical (disk style) master lock in very little time. I was quite surprised how easily it opened. I might actually take some keys off my keyring and start just carrying around a couple of picks!

Anyways, I went by a local locksmith and bought a "Key-In-Knob" cylinder. Made by GMS, and I'm pretty sure it has 5 or 6 pins. Are they any good ways to practice without taking pins out? Last time I tried that I trashed an expensive commercial Master lock. Stuff kinda flew out everywhere. I managed (combination of raking and poking with a pick) to open it twice, but not with any kind of regularity or skill. Help would be great!

[Solomon]

I bought a nice set of picks (Southord, can't remember how many) and have been experimenting with them on a number of padlocks. I managed to rake open my cylindrical (disk style) master lock in very little time. I was quite surprised how easily it opened.

That'll be the master #40... apart from being so easy to pick they're actually pretty decent locks. You'd have a hell of a time trying to bust one of those off its hasp, but yeah, you only need to shake a pick at them and they drop right open so as far as I'm concerned they're pretty useless. I know 99% of bad guys don't pick locks, but those things wouldn't even fend off a complete amateur.

Anyways, I went by a local locksmith and bought a "Key-In-Knob" cylinder. Made by GMS, and I'm pretty sure it has 5 or 6 pins. Are they any good ways to practice without taking pins out? Last time I tried that I trashed an expensive commercial Master lock. Stuff kinda flew out everywhere. I managed (combination of raking and poking with a pick) to open it twice, but not with any kind of regularity or skill. Help would be great!

You don't need to take a lock apart and put it back together a pin at a time to practice. Just start off with basic stuff, concentrate on what you're doing and resist the urge to rake the lock... you'll get the hang of it after a while. Read the "7 habits of the highly effectual lock picker" thread and work that stuff into what you're doing, it's really great stuff. And if you insist on doing the whole pin at a time thing, just don't let things go flying off into the distance when you take the cylinder apart... simple as that.

[Josh K]

I bought a nice set of picks (Southord, can't remember how many) and have been experimenting with them on a number of padlocks. I managed to rake open my cylindrical (disk style) master lock in very little time. I was quite surprised how easily it opened.

That'll be the master #40... apart from being so easy to pick they're actually pretty decent locks. You'd have a hell of a time trying to bust one of those off its hasp, but yeah, you only need to shake a pick at them and they drop right open so as far as I'm concerned they're pretty useless. I know 99% of bad guys don't pick locks, but those things wouldn't even fend off a complete amateur.

You don't need to take a lock apart and put it back together a pin at a time to practice. Just start off with basic stuff, concentrate on what you're doing and resist the urge to rake the lock... you'll get the hang of it after a while. Read the "7 habits of the highly effectual lock picker" thread and work that stuff into what you're doing, it's really great stuff. And if you insist on doing the whole pin at a time thing, just don't let things go flying off into the distance when you take the cylinder apart... simple as that.

I did have a good talk with the guy who ran the shop. He said that in the ten or so years he's been working, the vast majority of locks that have been compromised were either kicked in or broken. Only one or two a year showed no signs of anything, and he guessed that they were bumped. Interesting stuff.

I'll read up on that and see where it goes from there. Thanks.

[Solomon]

I did have a good talk with the guy who ran the shop. He said that in the ten or so years he's been working, the vast majority of locks that have been compromised were either kicked in or broken. Only one or two a year showed no signs of anything, and he guessed that they were bumped. Interesting stuff.

I'll read up on that and see where it goes from there. Thanks.

I doubt bumping is anywhere near as prevalent as the media makes it out to be, but I guess it's bound to happen occasionally. Here's something to ponder though... a lot of people keep spare keys hidden outside, and I use the word "hidden" very loosely. Why would a burglar need a bump key when he can just look under a few things, or maybe inside that really conspicuous fake rock, to see if the owners have been kind enough to leave the actual key there for him to use?

I honestly wouldn't be surprised if burglars actually go looking for these things, or try the doors to see if they're left unlocked, before busting out the crowbar. I'd say crackheads letting themselves in with the key you keep under the mat/wheelie bin/flower pot is a much more realistic scenario than some junkie making a bump key and getting in with that. I'm not saying bump keys are never used for crime, but the people out there who leave keys outside or fail to lock their doors would probably account for more of these unexplained entries than "bump thieves" do.

I know a few people who stash keys outside and I personally think it's a really stupid idea. Master lock makes a wall mounted safe to keep spare keys in, but that's even worse if you ask me... it's a blatant advertisement that says "free house keys", and whereas they're probably tough as nails I doubt they're hard to bypass. Of course now we're getting grossly off topic, so I'm gonna stop my ranting there.

[raimundo]

hey grossly off topic is where I was going reading your post, consider a mantrap entrance that has a hidden key outside to let in those who single themselves out by finding the key and not only using it but actually entering. then when the door shuts, negociations are the only way out, when someone comes to check the trap.
A mantrap entrance is typically used in jewelry stores and such, so that you enter a a door to a small space and then have to buzzed in or buzzed out at the second door. the walls and ceiling are hardended, but most commercial ones have lexan window to see into them.