American Lock

[Murff]

For my second lock I'm trying to pick, I dragged out and old American Lock Company brass padlock. It was origianlly issued to me back in 1987!

I've been working on it for a few hours, and I can't get it open. I've tried counting, adn when I let off tension I can distinctly here either 4 or 5 pins resetting. If my count is right, it's a 5 pin lock.

with the key, the lock open easily with no binding of anything, and the key only need to be turned to the 1:00 or 1:30 position to get the lock to spring open.

On the same topic, this lock was stored with the key in it for many years, does that negatively affect the lock?

Thanks in advance.
Murff

[Eyes_Only]

It might put some additional pressure on the springs but I don't see anyway a spring that has been deformed by being compressed to a smaller size would affect picking much, if at all.

[Josh K]

American locks have spooled and serrated pins. You're probably getting a false set somewhere along the line.

[ChemicalRobot]

Here are some pointers I've come to realize while working with my own American locks.

• Place your tension wrench in the top of the keyway. Not only will this allow you more room to maneuver your pick, but it will also distribute torsion on the pins more equally.
• Beware of the false-false-set. American locks take a lot of power to turn and unlock them. Sometimes it will drop into what you think is a false set when really you have unlocked it. If you think the lock has dropped into a false-false-set, grab a screwdriver and try to give it a turn!
• Watch out for the serrations, but don't be intimidated. American locks often have serrations on both the driver pins and the key pins. This can make it pretty tough to feel for the set. Vary your amount of tension and eventually you'll get a feel for what is a serration and what isn't. Also, there are spool-serration hybrid pins, but they shouldn't be much of a problem as they aren't really any more difficult than regular spool pins.
• If you can't get a feel for it, start off with just 2 or 3 pins. American locks are quite easy to re-pin, so if you can take it apart then take out some pins and then work your way up to a full lock. This is how I learned to work with these locks and it was a great help. Look for a retaining screw underneath the shackle when it's unlocked.

Hopefully the above is relevant to your lock. I'm not sure how much American locks have changed the past 23 years.

[loki-aka]

Just curoius. What pick type are you using, medium hook, small diamond ?

Some people have certain habbits and favorite tools for specific lock brands.

[Murff]

Just curoius. What pick type are you using, medium hook, small diamond ?

Some people have certain habbits and favorite tools for specific lock brands.

I was using a medium hook (of the 4 hooks I have, it's the 2nd longest). I haven't tried using the diamond yet.

[kj4guu]

Thanks for posting your reply ChemicalRobot, I have an American disck lock that has been giving me a lot of trouble and found that using your tips greatly improved my ability to open this lock.. It is a stiff lock even with a key and when opening I detect a resistance I can only describe as cam like. Upon close inspection I found that the first pin has at least one groove cut into it and all the pins will shift about quite a bit as if they are not snugg in the holes. This difficult lock took me about a day and a half to open the first time and only after reading this bit of advise did I understand why.

Here are some pointers I've come to realize while working with my own American locks.

• Place your tension wrench in the top of the keyway. Not only will this allow you more room to maneuver your pick, but it will also distribute torsion on the pins more equally.
• Beware of the false-false-set. American locks take a lot of power to turn and unlock them. Sometimes it will drop into what you think is a false set when really you have unlocked it. If you think the lock has dropped into a false-false-set, grab a screwdriver and try to give it a turn!
• Watch out for the serrations, but don't be intimidated. American locks often have serrations on both the driver pins and the key pins. This can make it pretty tough to feel for the set. Vary your amount of tension and eventually you'll get a feel for what is a serration and what isn't. Also, there are spool-serration hybrid pins, but they shouldn't be much of a problem as they aren't really any more difficult than regular spool pins.
• If you can't get a feel for it, start off with just 2 or 3 pins. American locks are quite easy to re-pin, so if you can take it apart then take out some pins and then work your way up to a full lock. This is how I learned to work with these locks and it was a great help. Look for a retaining screw underneath the shackle when it's unlocked.

Hopefully the above is relevant to your lock. I'm not sure how much American locks have changed the past 23 years.

[Ortin468]

A tall order for only a second attempt. Not impossible but a good challenge. Put it down and work on simpler locks if you get frustrated. Patience is the key (no pun intended LOL).

[raimundo]

Im assuming you still have the key to this lock, if so, put the key in the lock and turn the plug, note any spring resistance that you may have with the key, some older american locks did have a return spring on the plug that had to be overcome.

kj4guu is right, but, top of keyway tensors have to be built to fit the lock, and they cannot impinge on the first pin so they must be short. This means that a problem with them is that they tend to fall out if you are holding the lock by hand, if you place the lock in a vise you may have less of a problem. both top of keyway tension and bottom of keyway tension have their issues to be aware of.

a good bottom of keyway wrench for these locks is a wide tensor, fully as wide as the straight right hand edge of the keyway as far as it goes till the keyway turns leftand can be made from some wiper inserts, good wiper inserts have a rounded edge, if you cut down the width of your tensor to fit the designated part of the keyway, cut only on one side and leave the side that is down rounded so that it has less friction against the drill breaker and the cylinder wall, there are some caveats, the bottom of keyway wrench will rest on the drill breaker in front of the plug and this edge is a rough fracture edge made by a punch press, this will resist the turning, and you should be aware of it, you may be able to put some small tubing on this portion of the tensor to provide slippage rather than a friction lockup.

You say you are using the second largest of your hooks, I would go smaller, possibly the smallest, and thin shafted as well.
pick for only a minute and before dropping tension, use a small straight blade screwdriver in the upper keyway to test to see if it is in fact picked but not turning, this happens sometimes on these american locks. do not continue picking for a longer time without dropping the tension as it is not likely to serve any purpose. I have mentioned this before and people have replied after trying this, it might be possible to search the posts for american locks and find this and other tips.

[stratmando]

Didn't see, but may have been mentioned?, Have you looked at the key carefully to help with picking?

[جاناتان]

I pick the American 5260 in about 5 seconds each time single pin picking. If your lock is anything like it...then use top of key way tension, and there are no words to describe how little tension to use...so little that the wrench may fall out under its own weight