Just starting, Tricky pin

[aku]

Hey girls and guys.
I just started picking, I was getting along with two pins in the lock but when I added the third pin,
I couldn't pick it. after hours of reading at slowly moving the pins around I changed on of the pins
for a smaller one it popped open in seconds. I think I just got a tricky pin out of the gate,



How would you hand the third pin here. From the top view you can see it is the first to (I don't have the terminology) bite/get stuck/ hit the line.
It is also longer that any other pin, And it blocks by picks from reaching the pins behind it. I can set that pin and not get to the others or I can push
it up too far and get at the others, both are useless situations. How would you handle it?

[Josh66]

Bind is the word you were looking for.

It helps to have a long hook - one long enough to set the pins behind that one without disturbing it. A lot of locks are keyed that way, so it would be better to just go ahead and learn to pick it instead of swapping the pin out for something easier.

[aku]

Thanks, for the reply, I do have a longer hook but not show in the diagram, right under the pin is...am one of those zig-zag/meanders, I'll call it a shelf for now.
The pins final position rest almost right on it. I want to pick it with the correct pin in it, one of the things I did think of after I posted was applying tension in the
opposite direction, this lock opens both ways but I'd like to learn how to do this.

[Josh66]

What you are referring to is the warding. It can certainly make picking a pain in the ass...

What I do is sort of 'roll' the pick around the warding. Short hooks work best for this, but with that long pin blocking the other two you may not be able to use one...

Not really sure what else to add... Just keep at it and you'll get it.

Picking in the opposite direction would work too. That would make that the last pin to bind instead of the first... Sometimes that isn't an option though.

Most of the locks I have are pinned with a long pin blocking at least one short pin. They do that because they know it makes it harder to pick, lol.

[aku]

Thanks Josh.
I've made a lot of progress even since you posted last. I can easily pick the three pins now using the short hook and raking with a variety of rakes.
I need to improve my feel before adding the awkward pin back in but its miles better than it was a while ago, I'm about to move up to four pins,
I'll put that one pin back in later/tomorrow. Thanks though really.

[aku]

Because I hate finding threads like this that don't have a conclusion.
I'm up to 5 pins now, I can pick the whole lock with a variety of tools
usually in under a minute. I went back to the original configuration
and I can pick it opening the lock in the opposite direction but the combination
of having a very long pin that hits the binding point first means that
at least at my skill level with my tools it's unpickable. I hate saying that
though but there isn't room in there after the pin is set for my tools to get the pins behind
I think it actually goes into the warding a bit and it seems to need to be set first, that's
why turning in the opposite direction works but it's a very unsatisfying conclusion to me,
it's not an expensive lock.

[Josh66]

If you aren't doing this already, top of the keyway tension will free up a lot of room for the pick.
Just make sure the tension wrench isn't actually touching the first pin.

I find that top of the keyway tension is almost mandatory on restrictive keyways...

[Darkness1569]

Have you tried tensioning from the top of the key way? I have a couple of locks that I can't pick unless I tension from the top because of the warding. It could be that your picks are too thick for the keyway also, have you thought about buying or making a thinner picks? I find myself using my slim line set more and more.

[raimundo]

A TOK tensor is usually hand made, look at oldfasts video linked in the videos thread, he quickly picks 6 american padlocks.
the padlocks are the colored variety that are made with aluminum bodies, but I believe that the brass cylinders inside them are the same cylinders found in all 5pin american brand padlocks.
he is using a handmade TOK tensor that has a stop on it that does not allow it to set too deep where it would impinge on that first pin.

TOK and split tensors are an area where some kind of newer better idea is needed. Oldfast has a very good one for those locks.

[aku]

I thought of rotating the opposite way but I never though of applying tension at the top. Thanks so much, I'll try that. Picking the opposite way I often over pick that pin and release a little pressure, bouncing the tension wrench to drop the pin and open the lock. I'm sure it's an old trick to you guys but It felt so cool when I did it.
The key way is a little tight to begin with I had to file one of my picks already to get it in there.

[aku]

Ok, I've been practicing with tensioning from the top, I haven't tried the original pin configuration (Both because I haven't had a chance and I've lost the original config) but I think it will work. I didn't think the tools would get through the warding but with a little finessing I can worm it up there. Thanks guys, I'm hooked.