few random minor questions on lock feedback

[imanevilpairofsocks]

Have a few small questions and was just hoping to get some clarification and insight to help me out.

Can you place your pick in between pins and feel the cylinder? There have been times where I have not been able to press upwards whatsoever and am unsure if this is me missing the pins entirely or if the pin is just in a very tough bind. This usually happens beyond the first 3 pins

I have noticed that when a pin is overset, I am sometimes able to release tension and push it even higher and the lock opens. I am assuming this isn't viable for most locks, as the common method for dealing with overset pins is releasing tension and letting it drop. Are there locks that are designed to stop the key pin from going all the way above the shear line? Is it usually unviable due to stronger springs, pin stack height, bible size restrictions, a built in mechanism I am unaware of, or a combination of these? What is the likelihood of experienced pickers pressing both pins above the shear line while attempting to fix an overset pin without realizing it?

Is there any specific tell tale feedback that you have overset a pin during or after you have pressed it up? I have felt overset pins give me a multitude of feedbacks, ie mixture of free key pin movement, spring pressure, binding, etc. Is there a way to narrow the amount of feedback I receive?

Is there a specific method to decrease the likelihood of a pick getting stuck(difficulty in retrieving without resetting, inability to access deeper pins, etc)?

Are there any methods to rapidly increasing your sensitivity to pin feedback(other than the ones mentioned on these forums such as drills or placing a hair underneath a piece of paper)?

[Mighty]

I think pin stack height and height of the compressed spring are probably the biggest issues with pushing the key pins up into the bible. And you have to push them up past the top of the cylinder, so they need to go fairly high up in there. They actually make tools called 'comb picks' that are designed for this purpose however. Warding of the keyway could also be an issue with these, since you have to get that whole thing in there first.

You probably aren't putting your pick between pins, although sometimes at the very back of the lock you can reach beyond the pins and press the fixed metal there. You may have set all your pins and need to try harder tension for a second to see if the lock opens, you might need to be using less tension so you're not grabbing a difficult binding pin with too much force, or you may be at a false set and need to use gentle tension and feel for the counter-rotation. If none of these things seem to be the case, you might want to keep track of which pins you've set, so you know which ones are the most likely to need the harder push to set them. Which lock are you working on right now? It might be useful in figuring out your issue.

As far as oversetting, I find that when I've overset a pin, then all the other pins (including ones you have previously set) will usually return to having springiness/spring resistance, like when you started the pick. On expensive locks with security pins, I'll usually know I've overset a pin because the pin will have a big jump, and I'll lose my false set completely, and the springiness is back on all other pins. On cheaper locks it will sometimes feel like the overset pin will just slide up indefinitely with a smooth friction feeling, and won't come back down or ever click into a set. That's a redflag for me to check the springiness of the other pins. Then- like you said- I ease off and see if I can drop it down and save some of the other set pins.

For pin feedback, I find that time helps (as cliche as it is), but you might find putting the lock in a vise so that your fingers are only really touching/moving the picks will help. Also using picks with hard handles so any clicks are translated directly to your fingers

[nine4t4]

It's possible to hit the cylinder between the pins but it requires a lot of things happening. Some of my euro hooks are extremely pointed so they can do that. If you compare the area of pin chambers to cylinder wall between them, there isn't much material to hit

Mighty, nailed it. It's called OVERLIFTING. Most locks are protected against this by using the right springs and pins for the chambers. But the crap coming in from China.....

Dollars to donuts the feeling of an overset pin is what you are experiencing. The keypin is locked and it would feel like you're hitting between the chambers.

Tensioning is the hardest part to learn in picking. If you can get your wrench to really lock into the plug it helps. You'll have more control to back-off tension when you need to. I have some locks that are really hard with normal L-shaped BOK wrenches. But if I switch to something like a prybar at the top of the keyway, I have more control and can dance with overset pins (at least in that lock).

Look at it this way, the pick may be the thing that raise the pin too high, but its the tension wrench that holds it there.