Mortice Lever and Skeleton Keys

[stratmando]

Just starting to tinker with Mortice Lever, and Lever locks, a couple questions as they seem they could or do use same Blanks as Skeleton keys?
Seems keys for either if used on both side of door need to be symmetrical cuts. Seen some Lever Locks/Keys not symmetrical must operate from one side? Some Skeleton Keys look like they could be a combination of warded AND Lever? Is that done, or are they one or the other?
Any other questions I didn't ask?
Thanks in advance.

[Safecrackin Sammy]

Most of the old mortise lever locks use a bit type key. Kaba Ilco has a whole section in their key blank catalog. Machines to cut them are becoming more rare though.

"Skeleton key" is simply a bit key that has been multi milled to fit most simple common household mortise locks. Commonly sold in the old hardware stores and Kaba even shows the variety pack in their catalog.

If it is a double sided lock and the key uses the same lever pack then the pack would normally be symmetrical to allow the lock to operate from both sides with the same key. Limits the number of changes but most are interior doors anyway. I used to do some work in an embassy back in the 70's and they still used em!

Yes, some bit keys/locks do have some paracentric key way warding and corresponding key milling but its still just a bit key.

Not sure how far your delving into lever locks but keep in mind safe deposit, antique furniture, and some safe locks use lever locks but its more of a flat brass/steel key versus a bit key.

[stratmando]

Hey thanks, always had a curiosity about Lever locks. Watched some Locknoob and Andymac videos Making lever picks and picking, very interesting. Bought 3 different Lever picks, been on look out for BBQ skewers and other pick making material. Don't see much real use, mostly a puzzle. I do have a safety deposit box lock from eBay I bought a while back. Want to dig out and make some tools, I research what's available first, Banggood has a couple cheap practice Lever locks, 1 $22, other about $19.
Wanted to learn Safety Deposit lockpicking to service a Local Bank. They say they don't allow picking, must be drilled out. People feel more secure if lock has to be drilled. If they know it can be picked, they feel less secure about their Valuables?

[Safecrackin Sammy]

Picking lever locks is a limited market but fun. Probably has more value in the EU market where the locks are more common.

As you say, banks dont want SD boxes picked they want it to look hard to make the customers feel good about their security. Plus most SD locks have notched levers and fences making it not impossible but hard.

[stratmando]

Thanks, do most lever locks tension from the rear? Is middle and front ever used for tensioning? Thanks again

[Wizer]

Yes, many lever locks tension from middle. Like Boda 429: https://www.lockpicking101.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=58551&hilit=boda

[rphillips52]

Just starting to tinker with Mortice Lever, and Lever locks, a couple questions as they seem they could or do use same Blanks as Skeleton keys?
Seems keys for either if used on both side of door need to be symmetrical cuts. Seen some Lever Locks/Keys not symmetrical must operate from one side? Some Skeleton Keys look like they could be a combination of warded AND Lever? Is that done, or are they one or the other?

The answer from Europe to most of these questions, where lever locks are still recognised as capable of being both secure and robust, is: 'Maybe.'
A blank (not all lever locks use bit keys, though most indeed do), can be cut for a specific lock, warded or lever; or it can be cut away to pass all the wards in a particular set of warded locks of a type and size. Many lever locks, like other locks, eg pin tumbler, use wards also (more so in the past). That might be for differing, or simply to make the lock more reliable or resistant to manipulation. Many modern locks use a 'collar ward' as a keyhole bush, for example.
There are a few two-sided locks with pipe keys, which need not be symmetrical.
Many s/h lever locks appear on UK eBay, though sellers might not ship to foreign countries. Some lockshops will.

[pemlock]

Hey thanks, always had a curiosity about Lever locks. Watched some Locknoob and Andymac videos Making lever picks and picking, very interesting. Bought 3 different Lever picks, been on look out for BBQ skewers and other pick making material. Don't see much real use, mostly a puzzle. I do have a safety deposit box lock from eBay I bought a while back. Want to dig out and make some tools, I research what's available first, Banggood has a couple cheap practice Lever locks, 1 $22, other about $19.
Wanted to learn Safety Deposit lockpicking to service a Local Bank. They say they don't allow picking, must be drilled out. People feel more secure if lock has to be drilled. If they know it can be picked, they feel less secure about their Valuables?

They are very common in Sweden. A "standard" lock setup on an apartment door is usually a pin tumbler, nowadays an Assa Twin-something (or equivalent), and a symmetrical lever lock.
There are a few different reasons for this, I guess. An extra lock is good, and having a different type of lock means the villain needs two sets of tools an skill sets instead of just one. Another reason is integrity. The main lock has a master key, while the lever lock is your own, you have the only keys. If someone else need to have access to your flat for some reason you either have to make sure you're at home, leave the lever lock unlocked, or give them a spare key for the occasion.

[Squelchtone]

Hey thanks, always had a curiosity about Lever locks. Watched some Locknoob and Andymac videos Making lever picks and picking, very interesting. Bought 3 different Lever picks, been on look out for BBQ skewers and other pick making material. Don't see much real use, mostly a puzzle. I do have a safety deposit box lock from eBay I bought a while back. Want to dig out and make some tools, I research what's available first, Banggood has a couple cheap practice Lever locks, 1 $22, other about $19.
Wanted to learn Safety Deposit lockpicking to service a Local Bank. They say they don't allow picking, must be drilled out. People feel more secure if lock has to be drilled. If they know it can be picked, they feel less secure about their Valuables?

They are very common in Sweden. A "standard" lock setup on an apartment door is usually a pin tumbler, nowadays an Assa Twin-something (or equivalent), and a symmetrical lever lock.
There are a few different reasons for this, I guess. An extra lock is good, and having a different type of lock means the villain needs two sets of tools an skill sets instead of just one. Another reason is integrity. The main lock has a master key, while the lever lock is your own, you have the only keys. If someone else need to have access to your flat for some reason you either have to make sure you're at home, leave the lever lock unlocked, or give them a spare key for the occasion.

I wish America was like this. I have co workers who have only a Kwikset knob on their door, no deadbolt, and they tell me that "locks only keep honest people honest" and they don't even lock their door when they leave for work during the day. When I told someone it would be good to lock your door, they said it will cost more to replace the door and frame when a burglar kicks it in, versus just turning the knob and walking in.

*sigh*....
Squelchtone

[GWiens2001]

So do they leave their car unlocked, when it is so easy to just break a window and get into the car?

Gordon