Which keyway is this / resembles this most?

[JPontinen]

Heya. First post, yay



The keyway here is on a "Cocraft" brand 500 series padlock - surely China-made. I'd like to understand what to call the keyway. I've tried to spot it by image search, the closest one I've seen is the Yale GA, but that's about it, not sure about anything. EDIT: I think it's a knockoff of anything brand named in any case.

Is this a "paracentric" keyway? Image search results say: definately maybe, lot of different kinds of images come up.

Thank you.

[Safecrackin Sammy]

Welcome!

Its not a Yale GA for sure..

I would guess an Ilco 997X which looks like a smaller version of the "para" key way you mentioned.

[JPontinen]

Hi and thank you for the reply.

Looking at images, Ilco certainly have got something quite similar... However the keyway I have here most definately has the topmost part angled, on all Ilcos I can find it's pointing straight up and is quite wide. Here's another image of the same keyway with the padlocks they're associated with.

Maybe it doesn't matter so much, I'd just like to know is all



Thank you for your time!

[Safecrackin Sammy]

That pic the key ways do look larger so it may be a Para/Ilco 999/Y1

Hard to tell with having a blank to test it in.

Looks like these are made in the UK so it may be particular to that market.

[GWiens2001]

However the keyway I have here most definately has the topmost part angled, on all Ilcos I can find it's pointing straight up and is quite wide.

ILCO is not just a lock company. They are owned or own Silca. Combined, they are one of the largest key blank manufacturers in the world, if not the largest. The ILCO numbers mentioned are some of the key blanks they manufacture. The manufacturer may have one number they use to refer to the key, there are some "generic" key blank numbers, and most of the time each key blank manufacturer has another number they use to refer to the number.

To explain the different numbers, let me use a key blank for a Master No 3 padlock:

- Master Lock calls the blank the 1K
- ILCO calls it 1092
- The ILCO/EZ (generic number) is M1
- Curtis calls it 1092
- Silca calls it MS2

You can check the ILCO online key catalogs.

Gordon
Thank you for your time![/quote]

[JPontinen]

Thank you both for the information you've provided!

I will read the catalog and see if I can learn even more

- JP

[JPontinen]

Ok, I read the catalog. For a while, and then for an another while. There are so many that resemble this. These are very much like mine, but again, so were many others. The thing is, the same keyway seems to be on all the different sizes of these Cocraft locks - with 4, 5 and 6 pin variations. That would fit the 999B.

Here's pics of both the keys and keyways which I found to be, uh, something.




Thank you.

[GWiens2001]

If you have the paper version of the catalogs, or download the .PDF files and print them at full size, those outlines and profiles are all the correct size. That is helpful as sometimes the profile will be the same but it is 80% or 60% or whatever the size different. So you could lay the key down on it or hold the key point down on the profile and make sure it is the right one.

Gordon

[Wizer]

Terve,
While your keyways resemble maybe the most common keyway, YA1(Silca), it may be too big, or otherwise not fit those.
I have found many similiar locks to accept CES banks such as CE2, or CE6 (Silca).
And if all else fails, those padlocks could take the universal blank UL050, or smaller UL052 (Silca).
Hope this helps, sorry you have to cross reference these.

[JPontinen]

Terve / hello Wizer.

Thank you, GWiens, for the insight and method

Wizer, Those CE/UL keys and keyways sure look the part - with an exception to the key tip. On mine, it seems to be cut so that the top side has the smaller cut and the bottom side the bigger one. Is this just a choice by the manufacturer and not a "real" difference?

EDIT: Wait, does this only seem to be so - as what I'm looking at are blanks and mine is ground, so would that mean the cuts would actually line up with the blank examples IF the top side tip wouldn't have been ground to fit the bitting?

Thanks.

[Wizer]

When cutting keys to a blank that fits but is not exactly ment for that lock, you can use longer blanks and just grind off what you dont need. In keys that have a shoulder that stops the key and places the key cuts to the pins you need the deepest pin to set, after that the tip of the key only needs a ramp for the pins to slide into lock. Most locks have some room for a little longer tips, but you should cut the exes off anyway. There is rarely anything on the bottom side of keyway that requires a certain shape to the tip.