Difference between incorrect tools and lack of skill.

[ZriePrakis]

Good Day!

I've been practicing locksport for a few months now. I'm working with a pretty basic set of thicker picks (sorry, don't know the measurements) that have served me pretty well. Obviously I'm starting with locks I have around the house (padlocks, doors, etc.). So far I've found that, given enough time and persistence, I'm usually able to feel my way around these locks (all pin/tumbler) and get a repeatable open. One lock still eludes me - a Chinese clone of a 50mm Master 3DLF. It has a slightly paracentric keyway, and has a VERY rough turn with a key. I've bought a thinner set of picks to tackle the keyway, but the pins are also a bit rough. I can't get a thin pick to move the pins well if I'm bullying the lock, and I don't get good feedback with light pressure.

I could post a pic of the lock itself, but my question is more general - just wanted to give background. I get that, given enough skill, someone more advanced could probably open it with a hairpin. At a beginner skill level, though, how can one tell when a situation like this is a lack of appropriate tools or a lack of skill?

Thanks in advance!

[Raymond]

VERY rough turn with a key

This is more telling than anything else you said. Perhaps the lock simply needs lubrication. Carry on and have fun.

[demux]

Second what Raymond said. It's also possible the lock is just so poorly made that it's difficult to discern any useful feedback. It's ironic, sometimes some of the cheapest locks with the worst tolerances are the ones that can be most challenging to certain techniques. I assume you're trying now to SPP this, you might want to change technique and see if you get anywhere...

Also, per the forum rules I should add a word of caution against picking locks that are in use on things like your house doors, as you mentioned above. While not common, it is certainly possible for picking on those locks to cause internal problems that are difficult for a novice to detect and repair, and which may result in you locking yourself out.

[Squelchtone]

What exact pick sets are you using? something you got off Amazon for $10 bucks or a set of Sparrows or Peterson brand lock picks that you paid $100 for? big difference in quality and geometry.

[ZriePrakis]

Perhaps the lock simply needs lubrication. Carry on and have fun.

I'll give that a shot - Thanks!

I should add a word of caution against picking locks that are in use on things like your house doors, as you mentioned above.

Yes, SPPing right now, and completely agree. When we moved into our home I made sure I had a spare knob and bolt assembly with cores. Wouldn't risk screwing up something I can't replace. The core in the padlock is badly made. I've had a hard time turning it with the key before all this. It's difficult to rake just because of the warding - it leaves little space to work. That brings me to the other points...

What exact pick sets are you using? something you got off Amazon for $10 bucks or a set of Sparrows or Peterson brand lock picks that you paid $100 for? big difference in quality and geometry.

Cheapo beginner's set from Amazon to start with. The picks and rakes are THICK, so they're great if the keyway is a straight shot. Since supplemented with some homemade wiper inserts, some TOK tensioners, and a couple thinner Peterson hooks (0.015). Again, sorry I can't give thicknesses on the cheapo kit - no calipers. I didn't want to move up to something more expensive in case I found that I didn't enjoy it. Guess the fact I'm here proves I do. I'm just trying to make sure I'm not blowing money on better (or wrong) tools if I just need to use lubrication & practice more.

Thanks, all. I'll keep plugging away!

[demux]

Since supplemented with some homemade wiper inserts, some TOK tensioners, and a couple thinner Peterson hooks (0.015).

.015 should fit it most anything common, but are a bit more prone to breakage, especially if you still have a bit of a heavy hand. For a starter set, I'd recommend something in the .020 range. My first set was a Southord in I believe .022 or .023 or something - don't remember exactly but I know it was less than .025 and a bit thicker than .020. It was relatively cheap and good to learn with and it felt sturdy enough for a beginner's hands.

[boxtool5]

I'm probably at a similar stage, I have discovered a few locks like this in my collection. If you've checked that your tensioner isn't rubbing or catching somewhere, sometimes simply trying another one works for me. I have had a few locks go from "impossible to easy" by changing the tension tool (and/or type) and sometimes a different pick too. Sometimes I can see and understand exactly why, sometimes not.
I tried to lubricate a lock I found in the mud, I hadn't been picking long enough, it was a better quality core from a Master Pro Series. In hindsight, I consider lubricating that lock a mistake but a good learning experience. It seemed like all it did was help every pin I set drop as soon as I moved to the next one. The first thing I did when I got that one dismantled was to clean & dry it. Lube will probably be necessary again someday, hopefully I have a bit more control & finesse the next time I use it.

[stratmando]

If you get quality picks, picks are removed from the equation. Then you know it is your skill or lack of.
They are not a bad Investment, Saves you from calling a Locksmith, can save you money over time.

[demux]

If you've checked that your tensioner isn't rubbing or catching somewhere, sometimes simply trying another one works for me. I have had a few locks go from "impossible to easy" by changing the tension tool (and/or type) and sometimes a different pick too.

This is another good point that should be highlighted. In addition to the proper picks, you'll also want at least a couple tension tools in various thicknesses for both TOK and BOK. Honestly, I would probably rate a good/proper tension tool as even more important than a quality pick. If you can't properly control your tension, you'll never get anywhere.

[ZriePrakis]

Hey - I just wanted to hop back on here and close the chain. Lube = +1. Also, pin #1 in the lock was REALLY easy to overset. picking from the back of the core got me an open almost every time. Thanks for all the advice! Trying to move on to more difficult picks now!