Schlage F keyway and SC1 key

[Ry_C]

Holding it up next to squelchtone’s chart, the lock does look like an H. Can an H lock be turned by every key below it on the chart? If so, that seem like they gave me something even more common than a C... :/

[cledry]

Holding it up next to squelchtone’s chart, the lock does look like an H. Can an H lock be turned by every key below it on the chart? If so, that seem like they gave me something even more common than a C... :/

You are not understanding things correctly. There are no H cylinders. H is a key blank that will fit into the three keyways below it. What you have is an aftermarket cylinder known as a C-K keyway. It is a composite keyway so that locksmiths don't have to stock all keyways. So the C will enter it, as will the E etc. Obviously the master sectionals H and the top level master sectional will enter. The L is so thin they are difficult to duplicate. Schlage used to make those blanks from steel because nickel silver would twist and break.

[billdeserthills]

Feel so stupid. Really confused about what he actually gave me but didn’t think to look at the key that came with the lock! The key says Schlage on one side and has an H on the other side. So guessing this is a Schlage H cyllinder? Also dissassembled the door hardware and took out the lock but there is no letter on the bible, just blank

Or did they just give me a C cylinder and tell me a C key wouldn’t turn it, thinking I would never try it to make me feel good and go away? They are the main locksmith in a town of 40,000 and have been in business for years but I did get the impression they had bigger fish to fry than rummaging through their inventory for a compatible 5 pin lock... :/

Thanks everyone for your patience and help

Here is the lock removed from hardware with included key:

Nothing to feel stupid about, your locksmith didn't provide the E or F cylinder he said he would & that isn't your fault
I have loads of these cylinders in my shop, along with all the different keyways that fit them & each other, which is what Squelch's chart shows. The H keyway fits into C, CE & E, but if your cylinder was an E or an F the C key wouldn't go into it

[demux]

maybe a pair of Bogota rakes.. do the meth head jiggle.

You heard it hear first folks, a whole new style of lock picking. Can't wait to see mention of this show up in a BosnianBill video...

[Ry_C]

Nothing to feel stupid about, your locksmith didn't provide the E or F cylinder he said he would & that isn't your fault

He didn’t specifically promise an E or F or even Schlage for that matter, just said he would supply a lock with an uncommon keyway that most people would not have a bump key for.

You are not understanding things correctly. There are no H cylinders. H is a key blank that will fit into the three keyways below it. What you have is an aftermarket cylinder known as a C-K keyway. It is a composite keyway so that locksmiths don't have to stock all keyways. So the C will enter it, as will the E etc. Obviously the master sectionals H and the top level master sectional will enter.

Thanks! So when they told me, “A normal SC1 that you can get at Home Depot will go into this lock but wont turn it.” ... that was intentional or unintentional misinformation, correct? Maybe I should ask for my money back and find something myself online...

[billdeserthills]

Nothing to feel stupid about, your locksmith didn't provide the E or F cylinder he said he would & that isn't your fault

He didn’t specifically promise an E or F or even Schlage for that matter, just said he would supply a lock with an uncommon keyway that most people would not have a bump key for.

You are not understanding things correctly. There are no H cylinders. H is a key blank that will fit into the three keyways below it. What you have is an aftermarket cylinder known as a C-K keyway. It is a composite keyway so that locksmiths don't have to stock all keyways. So the C will enter it, as will the E etc. Obviously the master sectionals H and the top level master sectional will enter.

Thanks! So when they told me, “A normal SC1 that you can get at Home Depot will go into this lock but wont turn it.” ... that was intentional or unintentional misinformation, correct? Maybe I should ask for my money back and find something myself online...

It's nice of you to protect him, do you still think he has provided you an uncommon keyway?
All he's provided that is uncommon was the H key, which is helping you how again?

[Ry_C]

It's nice of you to protect him, do you still think he has provided you an uncommon keyway?
All he's provided that is uncommon was the H key, which is helping you how again?

No sir! Just wanted to be double-sure I had the facts straight before I go have an unpleasant conversation with guys (hopefully) much more knowledgable than me at a place not exactly famous for being polite to customers. Thanks Bill!

[Squelchtone]

at a place not exactly famous for being polite to customers.

haha, I can't tell if you mean the place is this forum or another locksmith shop.

the peanut gallery and I can be a little short with new members once in a while, but we are working on it. well, i know I am, I can't speak for the peanut gallery.


Squelchtone

[RedStagKiller]

What about something like this?

https://www.amazon.com/Keyed-Patio-Slid ... urity+lock


Surely adding one of these to the top and bottom would keep him out.

[billdeserthills]

What about something like this?

https://www.amazon.com/Keyed-Patio-Slid ... urity+lock


Surely adding one of these to the top and bottom would keep him out.

Your lock is intended for use on the inside of the door, as it doesn't come with one way screws. If the bolt can't be locked in the open position (likely not) it could be deadly if used on the outside of the door, as it couldn't be unlocked from the inside

[RedStagKiller]

What about something like this?

https://www.amazon.com/Keyed-Patio-Slid ... urity+lock


Surely adding one of these to the top and bottom would keep him out.

Your lock is intended for use on the inside of the door, as it doesn't come with one way screws. If the bolt can't be locked in the open position (likely not) it could be deadly if used on the outside of the door, as it couldn't be unlocked from the inside

Fair point, the description does indicate that it is for interior and exterior but you would need to be able to lock it in an open position. That is why I run it past you guys.

[Ry_C]

Just got back from talking to the locksmith. When I told him what you guys said about it being an uncommon key with a common cyllinder that would accept a SC1 key, he gave an embarassed “Oh.” like he had forgotten that and said he would talk to his boss and try to find me another that will work. I think that guy is an apprentice so I’ll give them the benefit of the doubt that they tried to pull a fast one on me.

Thanks for the keyway education guys, very helpful!

[demux]

Maybe I should ask for my money back and find something myself online...

Sounds like you already got the issue worked out with your local locksmith, but I'll just say for the record: That's certainly an option, and you may even save some money that way, but doing so makes it incumbent upon you to make sure you're getting the right item that will in fact work. There are a lot of variations of such things (5 or 6 pin, correct tailpiece, etc) and generally in those sliding door locks only one type will fit and work correctly. You'll also need to consider if the cylinder you buy online is zero bitted (in which case you may need to pin it and/or cut keys for it) or comes with keys (in which case how many, and is it part of a larger lot the merchant is selling that are all keyed alike, and how will you get more keys if you need them).

So in other words it's certainly an option, but one you may want to think twice about if you don't have at least a bit of experience selecting and maintaining lock hardware. That experience is part of what you're paying for when you do business with a competent locksmith.

[cledry]

The trick is finding a 5 pin cylinder that is sufficiently weird. I seem to recall Medeco made a 5 pin version.

[RedE]

The trick is finding a 5 pin cylinder that is sufficiently weird. I seem to recall Medeco made a 5 pin version.

Sometimes you pay for it, but yeah, Medeco makes a cylinder to fit just about anything.

And sorry for being late to the game here, but I just went through the Ilco price book, and even though they don't offer 5 pin cylinders in a lot of keyways like the 6 pin, there are still some slightly unusual options. Some are more obscure than others, but they are: Arrow, Corbin 60, Corbin L4, Dexter, Lockwood 1004A, Lori 80, Russwin D1 and 981R, Schlage E, and Segal 9.

Good luck!