Newbie has two questions on pin setting and picks

[Jorge]

I'm probably one of your older members but have very much enjoyed getting into what I view as an interesting challenge or hobby. Like some people do crossword puzzles, trying to pick a lock is a fun way to pass the time. I know we're supposed to use the "search" feature to avoid asking repetitious questions and I've done that. Yet, there are two questions that I'm not sure have been completely answered already. Or at least I couldn't find the answers. I've worked on a a cutaway practice lock and spent hours practicing on my home and office locks with some degree of success. Some deadbolts I can open, some I can't. And so on. Here are my questions.

I can feel each pin and will lift it to what I hope is the shear line. I certainly can tell when a pin has not set because it clearly is very springy. But, I have trouble telling when I've overset a pin so that the bottom pin presumably is binding. All I can tell is that the pin seems to be up. Is there any rule of thumb that provides more guidance on how fast and how high you lift a pin and when you can tell if the bottom pin is wedged in the sheer line? Am I pushing it up too quickly and, if so, are you supposed to lift each pin very slowly? Am I pushing them up too high and, if so, how can I tell that. I really can't feel that microscopic movement when a pin sets on the shear line. All I know is that it looks like all the pins are up, none are "springy" yet the lock won't turn.

Second question: I bought a set of picks some of which seem rather out of the ordinary (like with a ball on the end, two semi-circles on the end, an extreme hook on the end, etc.). I see that many people apparently like the half diamond but I've yet to make that work. I also have never been able to use a snake end successfully. I've found some success with one that looks like a W, and one with a moderate curve, and one long rake. Otherwise, the rest seem useless. I'm sure that you will say that it all depends on the lock. One pick may work well for one lock and a different pick for another. But, how do you know which pick to use? And, if you had to generalize, what two or three picks do you find to be successful on 90% of the locks?

Thanks for your help, guys.

[freakparade3]

I'm probably one of your older members but have very much enjoyed getting into what I view as an interesting challenge or hobby. Like some people do crossword puzzles, trying to pick a lock is a fun way to pass the time. I know we're supposed to use the "search" feature to avoid asking repetitious questions and I've done that. Yet, there are two questions that I'm not sure have been completely answered already. Or at least I couldn't find the answers. I've worked on a a cutaway practice lock and spent hours practicing on my home and office locks with some degree of success. Some deadbolts I can open, some I can't. And so on. Here are my questions.

I can feel each pin and will lift it to what I hope is the shear line. I certainly can tell when a pin has not set because it clearly is very springy. But, I have trouble telling when I've overset a pin so that the bottom pin presumably is binding. All I can tell is that the pin seems to be up. Is there any rule of thumb that provides more guidance on how fast and how high you lift a pin and when you can tell if the bottom pin is wedged in the sheer line? Am I pushing it up too quickly and, if so, are you supposed to lift each pin very slowly? Am I pushing them up too high and, if so, how can I tell that. I really can't feel that microscopic movement when a pin sets on the shear line. All I know is that it looks like all the pins are up, none are "springy" yet the lock won't turn.

Second question: I bought a set of picks some of which seem rather out of the ordinary (like with a ball on the end, two semi-circles on the end, an extreme hook on the end, etc.). I see that many people apparently like the half diamond but I've yet to make that work. I also have never been able to use a snake end successfully. I've found some success with one that looks like a W, and one with a moderate curve, and one long rake. Otherwise, the rest seem useless. I'm sure that you will say that it all depends on the lock. One pick may work well for one lock and a different pick for another. But, how do you know which pick to use? And, if you had to generalize, what two or three picks do you find to be successful on 90% of the locks?

Thanks for your help, guys.

First off welcome to the site. What kind of lock is it that you are having problems with? It sounds like it may contain security pins. If you have a pin set properly the bottom pin should be loose, ie, you can feel it move up and down with no spring tension. Do a search for security pins and try those techniques. As far as picks go, everyone has their own preference. I use mostly a hook of half diamond. The ball picks are very useful for wafer locks. The key to raking is to vary the tension as you rake, then spp any unset pins.

[Jorge]

Thanks much for your help. I can't say that the problem I've had is confined to any particular lock. It seems to happen with all my locks whether it be my office file cabinet or one of my house doors. I can easily tell when a pin isn't set because of the forceful "springy" action. However, there seems to be lots of times when I can't feel that action on any pin yet the lock won't turn. I'm assuming that I must have pushed one or more pins too high. That makes me question if there's a technique or rule to follow about how high you push a pin. Or maybe I'm pushing them too fast and sending the bottom pin past the shear line before the lock has a chance to move. That's why I wondered if there's some rule or guideline about how fast you move a pin upwards.

Thanks for the input about the picks. Seems like lots of the good pickers use the half diamond like you. I just can't seem to make it work. The one I've had the most success with is the pick with the end that's like an M or W depending which way you hold it.

[freakparade3]

The one shaped like a W is a rake. I use the hook more than the half diamond. I also have a half ball pick that I use alot on pin tumbler locks, I believe it's meant for wafer locks but it works well for me. Also, one of the golden rules here is never pick locks you rely on. They can be damaged. If you need any more help you can pm me. I'll help if I can.

[Gordon Airporte]

I guess it's hard to lift a pin too slowly, so no danger there. When it sets you should feel like it hit a wall and the plug will shift ever so slightly. This is all very subtle - having a decent pick sure helps, as does a long wrench to magnify the movement of the core. When you overset it will feel like you're pushing a lump up through the cylinder (pushing past the wall) and the plug will counter-rotate very slightly.
I suggest that you also try a hook pick for Single Pin Picking - they're pretty much standard, although you might come to prefer another shape for SPP once you have more experience.

[m3ph15t0]

I always use a hook for spp, I've never actually touched a half diamond. And when I lift a pin I feel a sort of scraping feeling as it slides along the tube thingee. (technical term there) I keep the tension light enough so that I can feel this scrape through my pick, and when it sets you'll probably hear a click noise. Also what gordon said about the "lump" is very accurate, but you'll only get this feeling if your using that perfect tension where you can feel the pins scrape. Also, if you're using just the right tension, it's really hard to over set a pin, and you know as soon as you do because of the "lump"

Here, check this> viewtopic.php?t=10677
It's my favorite, and it'll help you find that perfect tension.