Hi nice to meet you. What is your business?

[martinnn]

I am a fledgling lockpicker...



But the Associated Locksmiths of America trade group won't endorse lock-picking as a hobby.

"We're not for pointing out physical security flaws to the general public," said David Lowell, ALOA's associate executive director. "Just like I'm sure the Atomic Energy Commission would not endorse the Web sites that tell you how to build a nuclear bomb."

[LeeNo]

I am a fledgling lockpicker...
But the Associated Locksmiths of America trade group won't endorse lock-picking as a hobby.

"We're not for pointing out physical security flaws to the general public," said David Lowell, ALOA's associate executive director. "Just like I'm sure the Atomic Energy Commission would not endorse the Web sites that tell you how to build a nuclear bomb."

For the associate executive director of the Associated Locksmiths of America to compare himself with the Atomic Energy Commission is pure hubris.

They are nothing more than another lobbying group that solicits funds from interested parties and tries to use those funds to bribe legislators into passing laws that will benefit their contributors.

It is a sickening practice - like all such things.

Hey! I know how to do something and would like to teach others! BZZZZZZZT!!! WRONG ANSWER! We have people that would make more money if you didn't share your info and they have each given me money so I can bribe a Congressman to make it so that what you are doing is illegal!

Welcome to America.

[Eyes_Only]

Who cares if the ALOA refuses to recognize our culture as a legitimate group or organization.

I've seen how locksmiths pick locks cos I'm working as one and I'll tell you this much, people from the locksport culture is way way waaaay better at this than 70% of the professional locksmiths out there.

These guys are just plain angry and jealous because now the general public has access to information and tools to help themselves if the situation came and not have to pay bank for a lockie to do something a 14 yr old can do.

[josh0094]

and not have to pay bank for a lockie to do something a 14 yr old can do.

was that a simple referance to me i read there..

never give up on anything.. with persistance i think we can get them to reconsider.

[Eyes_Only]

I don't know. Visit almost any locksmith shop out there and start asking about lockpicking and bump keys and you'll get an icy reaction at most places. I've gotten icy reactions from just talking about locks a little bit more in depth than most of their regular customers.

But I like it this way better. Every organization has another more powerful and arrogant organization trying to squash them. We're like the underdogs thats pulling the rug from under them.

[gotta]

I no longer belong to ALOA for numerous reasons, one being their nose in the air attitude. Through the years of my career, I've worked with 3 different CML's. I learned a great deal from them early in my career, but they really just are letters. That being said, if a kid comes into my shop and asks questions about how locks work, I'll take the time to explain and show it to them if I have time. On the other hand, I'm not about to supply anyone with tools over the counter. There's plenty of other places to get them without someone getting the idea they want to sue me because there was an asset loss as a result. "We have the public's trust." It's an oath I take serious. It has nothing to do with ALOA. Most locksmiths don't share information. They're too worried about someone taking over their territory. Frankly I've never worried about that. As for lp101, I think the mods do a good job of weeding out those with less than good intentions. I don't think it's fair to lump all locksmiths in with the typical ALOA attitude, no more than it's fair to lump all teen lockpickers together as malcontents.

[martinnn]

"I've seen how locksmiths pick locks cos I'm working as one and I'll tell you this much, people from the locksport culture is way way waaaay better at this than 70% of the professional locksmiths out there."

thats dham true, i said it once and i'l say it again thiers no such thing as picking for profits, more like drill pins and force turn the cylinder and peplace, o one more thing charge up the ass,, i like

and another thing being a locksmith is nothing special or hard about being a locksmith, eny 14 year old can learn the basic services of locksmithing, i doen;t know why my last post was shut down, im sorry that english is my second language.

just becuase we polaks attacted tanks with pitch forks in world war 1 and 2 does'nt meen we are stupid, just a bit tippsy and pissed off

[gotta]

"I've seen how locksmiths pick locks cos I'm working as one and I'll tell you this much, people from the locksport culture is way way waaaay better at this than 70% of the professional locksmiths out there."

thats dham true, i said it once and i'l say it again thiers no such thing as picking for profits, more like drill pins and force turn the cylinder and peplace, o one more thing charge up the donkey,, i like

and another thing being a locksmith is nothing special or hard about being a locksmith, eny 14 year old can learn the basic services of locksmithing, i doen;t know why my last post was shut down, im sorry that english is my second language.

just becuase we polaks attacted tanks with pitch forks in world war 1 and 2 does'nt meen we are stupid, just a bit tippsy and pissed off

I tried a serious response, I guess it's comedy hour.

[Eyes_Only]

Yeah its true not ALL locksmiths are like ALOA, but there are a lot out there that are. But as long as you don't try to make the subject of lockpicking and bumping the icebreaker to start a conversation with them, some of them will respond favorably. But thats still a rarity, which is understandable though.

[gotta]

Yeah its true not ALL locksmiths are like ALOA, but there are a lot out there that are. But as long as you don't try to make the subject of lockpicking and bumping the icebreaker to start a conversation with them, some of them will respond favorably. But thats still a rarity, which is understandable though.

I think you nailed it. If you draw a parallel between this forum and a locksmith in a shop, a new guy in the door asking about bypassing a lock will get the same response, be it a locksmith or a member of this forum. This forum is pretty much self policing when it comes to that. I prefer the locksmith community operate that way without the likes of ALOA. Interesting.

[WOT]

Hvac-talk.com is a community for technicians and those in the trade technical tips, but you'll be thrown out if you talk price. They have an extreme resistance in the public finding out the cost of parts and have a high and mighty "HVAC is not DIY" attitude.

I don't think it has anything to do with the difficulty of work or whether a home owner can do it. I get a hint their hostility comes from that what they DIY means no service calls.

Locksmiths would preach guild of locksmith and "Public Trust" on the image that they pledge to keep their clients safe to their ability. While this is true to an extent, I believe something they do not mention for the sake of good image is "protection against competition(other businesses and DIYers)".

You entrust auto body repair and aircraft mechanics with your life and limb. Whether your car would be safe in a subsequent crash depend significantly on ethical practice of the repair shop.

When you ride a plane, you're entrusting aircraft mechanics have done the right thing to keep you safe.

List goes on, but locksmiths seems have greater attitude about this public trust thing

[gotta]

My experience with locksmiths is they are so territorial, they take it to the extreme that hardware stores and such shouldn't be able to make duplicates! On another forum I belong to, they get enraged about tow drivers unlocking cars, to the point of legislative talk! Give me a break. I've told more than one person how to unlock their car. This is where I see myself different. I have talked many a customer through a problem on the phone, or given them the option of bringing their locks to the shop to rekey instead of me charging my service call. It makes more sense to make at least the rekey price than nothing. Most homeowners are more than able to remove a few screws. It also gets them into my store where they can see 3 different lock lines that I have on display and even if they don't need anything else, it puts it in their head for the future. Besides, it's a lot less stressful. I can find plenty of other things to stress about.

[raimundo]

a loa is a saint in the candomble' religion of bahia brazil, check wiki

[WOT]

My experience with locksmiths is they are so territorial, they take it to the extreme that hardware stores and such shouldn't be able to make duplicates!

The Axxess+ fully automatic key cutter has a very high yield(low chance of non-working key) and requires almost no operator skills. It's also one of the most expensive key machine you can get. Keys that represent the greatest quantity can be had for less at Home Depot, Lowe's and Wal-Mart for longer business hours.

Why pay $15 for a KW1 rekey when you can get another one for about the same price?

Axxess+ hits them where it hurts, the pocket book. They take away the high volume key duplication business yet it has such a high capital cost basically only corporate chain stores can afford them.

[gotta]

I'm on the road probably 80% of the time, therefore I don't make a lot of keys in the shop. Usually the hard to find blanks, motel keys, my Primus stuff etc. I would think the larger shops and the ace and truevalue stores would feel the impact more. I'm sure they make more SC1's and such than I do. I make a lot of original auto keys, but those are usually done by appointment when someone thinks their locks are all broke when in reality they just need an original key.