Bogata vs. the Euro Euro Wave Jiggler style pick?

[lick]

I was lookin at Lock Pick Tools.com and saw this style pick, and was wondering if this Euro Euro Wave Jiggler style pick would work with same functionality as the bogata? It sorta looks like it but says it is a Euro Slim Line Pick. Any input on this would be very helpful.


Thanks,
Lick

[JK_the_CJer]

The genuine Bogota picks have a unique handle that complements the way they are used. Also, they come in pairs so that one may be used as a tension wrench. Its not quite correct to think of a Bogota as being a single tool; the pair-factor is a big part of it. I suppose, in theory, that the "euro wave" pick would work in a similar manner if you could get past the ergonomic difference.

Unless I missed something, that design was copied from Raimundo and is being sold in the bastardized standard-pick format. There may be more to the story than that and hopefully Rai will chime in with his thoughts. I've often wondered about how those "euro wave" picks came to be and always assumed it was a straight-up copycat affair. Then again, it might have been authorized or the design was set free.

[Schuyler]

Real deal or bust:

http://serepick.com/

As JK mentions, the handle is a big part of its use. As is the extraordinary hand polish. I'd suggest buying Bogotas or making your own (Rai has provided great instructions elsewhere on the site).

[dmux]

yea, there is no substitute for the original bogota crafted by rai. those euro jigglers are junk.

[Schuyler]

I would like to add here, though, that I love Rich from Lock Pick Tools. I've dealt with him often, he even gave Melvin from here a tour of his shop for NDE. He's been a friend to the Locksport community moreso than any other vendor I can think of.

That said? I've no clue how the whole wave jiggler thing started, and there are a lot of people knocking it off these days, but none of them hold a candle to the legit Bogotas.

[raimundo]

Someone on the lp101, handle of buzzy, contacted me and said he represented LPT.
I have a ton of his old pms saved to illustrate the controversy, this guy danced me around with pms for 6 months, then stopped answering my replies, for six months, during which time LPT made a punch and die and started making thier cheap, weak, knockoffs. then some members of the site started complaining about what they had done, and LPT and buzzy contacted me again, hoping for me to help them calm people down while they were once again negociating perfidiously with me.
There is no honesty in what they did. they are hustlers. that they can stamp out tools for about 2 cents in time and materials and sell them cheap at a still large profit is all they are about.

[raimundo]

Oh, and the design is given to the locksport community and if you want to make your own, or if you are handmaking them for your friends that is not a problem. Taking the design to manufacture for profit is another matter and for that you need to get real with me. Buzzy need not try, I know what to expect from him.

[Schuyler]

Glad to have the summary of what happened. I'll take no side, except to restate the obvious, nothing compares to a Bogota or Rai's craftsmanship thereof.

[raimundo]

Oh, yeah, the last straw with these guys, at the time Dmux was in bagdad and I had agreed to send him some picks, but I had none ready, so I told them, knowing that they were going to do as little as possible for me, to send him a set of their tools including the euro ripoff jiggler and that would be all I would ask. I stayed in touch with Dmux the whole time he was in Iraq and he never recieved the picks. That was actually a minimal offer for them to get right with me and they agreed to do it and didn't.

[milkman22]

hmm i recall that this site also used to have copies of the falle safe tools and some other knockoffs as well

[zeke79]

Geeez..... I had forgotten about this but Rai's posts reminded me of it. I am glad it is over as I was getting tired of getting phone calls from everyone all the time on LPT's side of things. I am glad glad glad that is over...

[Legion303]

Another voice of support: nothing compares to the original. Crappy stamped picks are what dealextreme is for if you just want something cheap to break. You want handmade quality, you ask Ray to make you a set.

-steve

[raimundo]

Sorry they bothered you Zeke, they were doing the same to me. hustlers!

[LocksmithArmy]

I wanted to write a short reiew about the euro euro wave jiggler here for anyone thinking of getting one

firstly straight out of the package it looks much different
yes the profile is the same but it has corners and a flat top that the bogota just doesnot have... which to me means it wont work as well

now to use a bogota it is quite violent, and the way you hold the pick is sideways from normal picks so I got my wave jiggler with the twist flex treatment...

when I began using the wave jiggler it did open the lock but it bent at the twist flex point... the I noticed it is Very weak where the twist is. I had to hold the shaf when I jiggled... and this defeated the whole purpose of having a handle at all. I only used this tool on kwiksets and the like, nothing that is remotly challenging.

overall this tool is almost worthless if you have a real bogota, in comfort the bogota is better and in practice. if you do decide to try one out, do not twist flex it.

thats all, enjoy

[Eyes_Only]

hmm i recall that this site also used to have copies of the falle safe tools and some other knockoffs as well

I have that replica set. The standard hook style is uncomfortable to use because of the way the hook design portion bends up at something like a right angle, tricky to move in the lock. The very tip of the picks are rounded making it difficult to keep the tip stable under the more sharper point of the bottom pin.

The curved fulcrum style picks are actually pretty nice but it shares the same problem that the original falle set probably has, you need a lock with a wide open keyway for it to be practical.

I keep it in my pick set cos it still has some use to it from time to time. Plus those came out way before the Wave/Bogota "scandal" happened. Since that "theft of design for profit" thing I haven't bought a thing from them cos that was pretty sleezy.