Those darn DOOR CLOSER(s)

[unlisted]

Well, I need some help. Yup, me.. who would of thunk it? (well, I do need lots of help, but thats a different story..)

I need to adjust one of these below- but even after finding the hardcopy of the install instructions, there is no "adjustment info" on how to make the door less heavy, or make it so its not trying to rip itself off the hinges when it gets to the "push stage" of closing.. heh..









http://www.nortondoorcontrols.com/ (manu. website)

So, can anyone give me some pointers, so I don't bugger it up worse than it already is? All I want to do is alter the tension.

Thanks

[unlisted]

Oh and no, I did NOT install it.. and another ripped off the door about 2 years ago- hence the damage..

[Squelchtone]

you need to find doordoctor on IRC or PM her on here.

[unlisted]

you need to find doordoctor on IRC or PM her on here.

Thought of that- than I noticed this:

Last visited: Mon Feb 15, 2010 2:08 pm

[MacGyver101]

I think that's a Norton 1600 -- and this comes with the caveat that I haven't adjusted one in a long time, and Norton's website is unreadable on my smartphone, so I haven't been able to double-check the instruction sheet.

There are three phases to the "swing" that you can control:

• The final bit of the swing, just before the door closes, is the "latch" phase: it should be adjusted with the "L" adjustment screw (and unscrewing the adjustment increases the pressure, if I recall correctly).
  
• Just before the "latch" point is the "sweep" phase: it should be the "S" adjustment.
  
• This is where memory is failing a bit: I can't recall if the third adjustment is for both the opening resistance and and third "delay" phase of the swing (i.e., for controlling the speed of the door swing when it's all the way open) -- or whether the third adjustment is just for the opening pressure.

My advice, in either case, is to set all of the adjustments to their lightest setting, and then start increasing them one at a time, in order to tune each of the opening/closing phases. Hope that helps!

[yng_pick]

I think that's a Norton 1600 -- and this comes with the caveat that I haven't adjusted one in a long time, and Norton's website is unreadable on my smartphone, so I haven't been able to double-check the instruction sheet.

There are three phases to the "swing" that you can control:

• The final bit of the swing, just before the door closes, is the "latch" phase: it should be adjusted with the "L" adjustment screw (and unscrewing the adjustment increases the pressure, if I recall correctly).
  
• Just before the "latch" point is the "sweep" phase: it should be the "S" adjustment.
  
• This is where memory is failing a bit: I can't recall if the third adjustment is for both the opening resistance and and third "delay" phase of the swing (i.e., for controlling the speed of the door swing when it's all the way open) -- or whether the third adjustment is just for the opening pressure.

My advice, in either case, is to set all of the adjustments to their lightest setting, and then start increasing them one at a time, in order to tune each of the opening/closing phases. Hope that helps!

I use the same methods as MacGyver101.
Do you know what strength the closer is? I do not know all that much about them, but from what I have been told, there are different strengths of the closers. I think it runs something like 1-6. Often you can adjust them by a couple numbers through an adjustment on the closer, but if it is rated high on the scale and is still slamming shut when you have gone the lowest possible, it may need a lower strength closer.

[unlisted]

Better photo of the printing




Also, anyone know which way I should be twisting the allen keys? Just kinda worried of something falling apart/ losing pressure(??) if I turn a allen bolt the wrong way.

[unlisted]

Hrm, figured it out through trial and error- Got the swing slowed down so its not a death trap, and I got the latch tamed as well, so it does not try to slam the frame... Weird thing, I cannot adjust how "heavy" the door is initially, no matter what.. (and its like moving a brick wall for the first 6 inches of opening)

[globallockytoo]

one tip to relieve the "weight" of the door is to take your car opening air wedge, slip it under
the door and pump it up.

It will lift the door taking pressure off the arm of the closer

[unlisted]

Its not the "weight of the door" its the "resistance" in pushing open the door from being fully closed...

Just so everyone knows, doordoctor came online IRC earlier, and spent at least half an hour walking me through tricks and tips- and now the door is not as much of a PITA to push open.. or to hold so it won't slam shut.

Thanks doordoctor and others

[DOORDOCTOR]

your welcome unlisted, glad I was in the room at the time to see you there,

the cause is because of the arm geometry (unlisted i know i told you in chat, just telling the others why its doing this and what to do) when the arms are close together (looks to be about an inch or so between the arm frame bracket and the closer's pivot) this makes the closer have the advantage of leverage,


during a normal installation of a norton 1600 series closer, many times (well should be, no matter if the closer is a fixed size or adjustable size closer) the arm frame bracket should b located OVER THE END OF CLOSER BODY, (about 4 inches from closer's main pivot) I can see in a way how this got installed this way, whoever installed it probably was using instructions from some 1950's closer (those old vintage traditional closers such as russwin and corbin model 126, 128 and 131, basically those closers that are sized with a LETTER not a number)



forgot to mention last night in chat, that forearm "shoe" (frame bracket) appears its for the LCN series regular arm closers, but since across many manufacueres they are interchangeable parts, although limited to mostly arms depending on the star punch (the hole that the closer pivot fits into )size and type (some closers the pivot is square, some hexagon shaped (LCN 4040, GEZE TS-5000 for example I guess they only had the rod and shoe (adjustable part of forearm and frame bracket) that came from an old LCN and a norton closer.

on a real norton/yale's forearm (regular arm installation), there will be a 3 hole adjustment on the "shoe" for placement of the arm to help with strength (maybe things have changed, but I know on MY 1604 (yes mine's a fixed sized closer the frame bracket has 3 hole position.

unlisted's closer's issue was made easier by adjusting the spring tension allen screw to lowest spring tension (next to UL stamp on left side of closer body) due to this closer being in a dorm, arm could not be relocated to a better position for best results in opening/closing cycle of door.

so morrow of the story with these "open then shut cases" if you have the install instructions READ THEM CAREFULLY, if not, go by the method I said, arm frame bracket goes above end of closer body.

note: if your a college student living in a dormitory room with one of these on your door, its not recommended that you mess with it, because if caught, you could get kicked out or other disciplinary actions imposed on you. if your door closer is having problems or is hard to open or is NOT closing, best to notify maintenance.

I mean I enjoy giving advice on and fixing closers, I just don't want to see or hear of the college dorm resident getting disciplined for "tampering/vandalism" while only trying to just fix a door closer because of maintenance staff not fixing it or just don't want to wait (sometimes a couple of years) for it to get done.

I'll also add, if anyone here has a question about fixing one of them (old or new, all brands) I'll be more then happy to help you figure it out and fix it)

-DOORDOCTOR

[exspook]

looks to me that the arm has been fixed in the incorrect place, based on the fitting template

that will impede the action of the closer

bit of WD40 (lube) on the hinges can help also

[unlisted]

bit of WD40 (lube) on the hinges can help also

...You do know that is a DE-greaser, right??? (so in the long run, it would really lessen movement..)

[straightpick]

Hard to tell what hand the door is from the pic, appears to be right handed. If so, the closer is mounted too close to the center of the door, should be about 7" from the hinge centerline to the first two mounting holes of the closer.

[exspook]

bit of WD40 (lube) on the hinges can help also

...You do know that is a DE-greaser, right??? (so in the long run, it would really lessen movement..)

http://www.wd40.co.uk/index.cfm?articleid=1519

maybe we got confused as WD40 is like this in the UK

it is a lubricant but does shift grease also...