Key Pin 2 of Refusal

[Omnivox]

Hello all, newb here.

I have been working on my SPP skills lately with a short hook and a half diamond. The lock that currently baffles me is a cheap Chinese Master No 3 clone. When I search for the binding pin it feels like pin 2 is the pin to pick first. Well I have learned that it is not. The issue that I face is that no matter how I interface (or not interface) with key pin 2 it will go all the way to the top and get stuck. I have to then release tension which drops all of my set pins. If I begin and try to set pin 3 or 4 (much tension applied) key pin 2 will still bind at the top. It seems that no matter what I do I will get key pin 2 stuck.

One note is that key pin 2 is very long as the bitting is deep in the key.

I can rake this lock open, but I refuse to be defeated.

Any advice on how to set or avoid this pin would be helpful. Thanks ya'll.

[fgarci03]

Hey Omnivox,
Welcome to the forum!

Tell me something, are you applying Top Of Keyway or Bottom Of Keyway Tension?
I remember to have had the same issue on really cheap locks when I started, but unfortunately I don't remember how I managed to overcome that, nor what it was.

What I would advice you to do is to set an amount of tension that you feel confortable with and try to keep it steady. Then, look for binding pins other than pin 2 (exactly what you did!), when you find nothing, lift pin 2 just a tiny fraction and test again. Eventually you are probably going to set something else. Always try to leave that pin for last anyway!

If none of that works, try to increase tension a little bit while lifting pin 2. Be VERY CAREFULL not to break/bend/damage your picks doing this. Maybe what is happening is that you overset pin 2 because the seting click is too faint for you to feel. With a little more tension it should become more clear.

I can't stress enough how carefull you must be not to ruin your tools!

Have fun, and good luck!

[kmh]

I find on my locks with extreme high and low biting that top of the keyway tension is the way to go. It gives more room to angle your picks enough to help avoid oversetting the previous pins. Using a deep hook helps as well (believe that the proper name for it).

Also try very light tension and just lightly touch each pin. My biggest mistake when I started was to much tension and I would just mash on the pins till they moved. I broke my best pick that way. Some locks do need a good amount of tension so you really have to try it all till you find what works for you.

[Omnivox]

I have tried TOK and BOK. It feels like pin 2 should be the binding pin but once it is in place nothing else will set at all. What is also weird is the bitting back 3 pins are high (including the pin in question) then the first pin is low in the key with a long key pin. I can rake it open with a "jiggling" approach pretty quickly.

[mikus]

Try dissasembling the lock and check out key pins, maybe pin 2 is just on a shear line and is very easy to overset. Pins in cheap locks are usually badly made and have very rounded edges, that also may be they reason you overset it when its almost at the shear line.

[kmh]

Mikus has a solid point. A lock I have been struggling with for a bit has a pin like that. It sets by putting my pick in the keyway and just lightly grazing it. Once I figured that out I can now pick the lock in 2-3 mins. I find that light tension was the key in my case as it allowed the pin to pop back to the sheer line if I did overset it. And when I say light I mean just enough to keep the tension wrench from falling out.

I personally wouldn't take the lock apart as you know it works fine, I would just keep at it and try a different approach every time.

[fgarci03]

Try dissasembling the lock and check out key pins, maybe pin 2 is just on a shear line and is very easy to overset. Pins in cheap locks are usually badly made and have very rounded edges, that also may be they reason you overset it when its almost at the shear line.

Mikus has a solid point. A lock I have been struggling with for a bit has a pin like that. It sets by putting my pick in the keyway and just lightly grazing it. Once I figured that out I can now pick the lock in 2-3 mins. I find that light tension was the key in my case as it allowed the pin to pop back to the sheer line if I did overset it. And when I say light I mean just enough to keep the tension wrench from falling out.

I personally wouldn't take the lock apart as you know it works fine, I would just keep at it and try a different approach every time.

It has happened to me on a Master Nº140 that the 2nd pin is already at the sheerline, so I just don't touch it. In the end I just have to lift 3 pins to get it opened.

You should try what KMH and Mikus suggested!

[DennisK]

Hello all, newb here.

I have been working on my SPP skills lately with a short hook and a half diamond. The lock that currently baffles me is a cheap Chinese Master No 3 clone. When I search for the binding pin it feels like pin 2 is the pin to pick first. Well I have learned that it is not. The issue that I face is that no matter how I interface (or not interface) with key pin 2 it will go all the way to the top and get stuck. I have to then release tension which drops all of my set pins. If I begin and try to set pin 3 or 4 (much tension applied) key pin 2 will still bind at the top. It seems that no matter what I do I will get key pin 2 stuck.

One note is that key pin 2 is very long as the bitting is deep in the key.

I can rake this lock open, but I refuse to be defeated.

Any advice on how to set or avoid this pin would be helpful. Thanks ya'll.

I feel your pain brother. I had both a Master #1 and a #3.The #1 wasn't much of a problem.I never did pick that #3,so I decided that this would be the lock I would hack apart to see what made it tick.Ofcourse there is no putting it back together now!