Dudley safe Key + Combination

[eyesonly]

Hi,

First off this is my first post, i've been into lockpicking for about a year and i've got a good selection of made picks and a little collection of padlocks etc which i practice on. I recently aquired a fully working sfe where I work as my manager asked me to remove it(the code has been lost but it's empty) as he didn't want it in the office. So i've moved it into the workshop where i've been working on it for a couple of weeks...

I know you don't discuss safes in the public section, but please answer me this one question- It's a dudley safe with 3 wheel combination dial PLUS a deep mortice lock, and then a handle to open it. I've spent about 10 hours graphing it etc so far and I ned to know does the safe require the key lock PLUS the combination, or is EITHER key or combination... cos if it's both i'm gonna pull my hair out becasue i've wasted a lot of time.

Idon't get much free time to post but i hope in the future i can share some of my knowledge of locks and any tricks i may have picked up. I'm more interested in safe cracking but i'm willing to put some time in on lockpicking to get into the restricted forums if possible.

Cheers for any info

Regards

Rich

[eyesonly]

P.S I can take some pics of it at work tomorrow if that helps!

Thanks

[master in training]

pictures will help along with a model number, as you said, safes arent discussed in the open forums, if no-one knows or is willing to answer, you should be able to contact dudley and quote the model number to them and they should be able to tell you if it needs the mortice and the combo, or one or the other.

i would guess that if its quite small, i would say it only needs one or the other to open it, if the safe is big, it is more likely it will need both.

sorry i cant help you more, but i dont know much about safe cracking, i want to get into it, but cant afford a lock or a safe to practice on yet!


~ Master in Training ~

[chopitup]

The standard locking is a high security double-bitted keylock. All keys are supplied in duplicate.

A 3-wheel keyless combination lock, digital locking or left-hand door is available as an optional extra. Capsule Deposit, Letter Deposit or multi-locking is also available.

Therefore I'm guessing the key alone will open it if you can't crack the combo.

I assume this is ok to post since it is just from a product catalogue I dragged up on a Google search. If not, mod away.

http://www.safety-works.co.uk/freestand ... dudley.htm

[chopitup]

http://www.dudleysafes.com/harlech.htm

Actually, it looks like it could be either. There's a list of the options there.

Locking options include: keylocking (fixed or detachable bits); dual keylocking; keylock & combination; mechanical or digital combination; time delay locks; time locks; digital/multi-user locks.

From the company webpage. http://www.dudleysafes.com/

[eyesonly]

Ok thanks for the help. I reckon it's either combination or Lock but i would hate to think i'm putting so much effort in for nothing! The key is also missing that's why the safe has been scrapped (well, i'm making good use of it for practicing!).

Cheers all

Rich

[Al]

You may wish to protect your hair before reading the following post.






If this Dudley safe has key and combination locks then BOTH need to be open before the door will swing. Almost all locks fitted to these safes are key retaining as standard, therefore unless it has been modified or forced the key lock will be most likely be in the locked position.

There are common exceptions to this but with a Dudley safe, on which you are using the techniques you have described, take the above as so.

[eyesonly]

Yeah thanks for the info Al, although i opened the safe today so i realised what you had just described. The key is just a day lock and thankfully had been left unlocked. I've removed it to get a key made now as my manager was so impressed i'd cracked it he's letting me have it (it's no use to him anyway as i wouldn't tell him the code!)

It's the first safe i've cracked and the feeling is TEN times better than padlocks etc. Although it was starting to lose patience towards the end, i spent about twenty hours on it, but i reckon i could do it again in about 3 - 4.

Cheers for all your help guys

[eyesonly]

I just had my camera phone with me to capture the moment!

[chopitup]

Congrats! I'm impressed.

[Al]

Just to confirm, when you mentioned keylock this was a disc tumbler barrel set into the dial to stop it turning rather than a separate lock. ? Obviously as the dial was free to spin it was not locked!

[eyesonly]

It wasn't set into the dial, just a seperate 5 lever mortice which also stop the main door handle turing. It was just a basic lock i've removed it to make a key up for it.

Can anyone give me an idea what this safe is worth second hand, as i'm thinking i might sell it as i've no use for it, and besides it's too heavy to get into my house without breaking something

And another question... i was going to make one of the little keys used to change the combination, could anyone post a pic of one or give me some dimensions to aid making one up?

Cheers for any help

Rich

[rayman452]

The chart you had, could you scan it? I've been trying to crack the dudley code, if you look in pick-fu. If the safe made by dudley shows a flaw, then the combinationn, which is much less secure, must have a flaw. IF only we could find it now...

[Orange_Crusader]

Hey, that could be helpful Nice idea, rayman. Since the lock is fairly new, it should at least be slightly similar to the padlocks (hey, those work fairly well against cracking, no?). Worth a try, even if it's not the exact same system, it could be related, and give us a small look into the mind of Dudley for the padlocks.

[TOWCH]

Not to be a downer but I doubt that graph will be much use to you. All I can see it telling you is the tolerances on Dudley wheel packs and even then that would only reflect on Dudley as a company and would not have any direct connection to your problem. The wheel packs between the two types of locks are different in design and any patterns you did notice are unlikely to be shared.