Banham help

[jamakabi1]

Alight guys, im pretty new to the locksmith game, got called out to my first job last night and it was a big nasty banham lock which i had no joy with.

anyone know any good course where you can learn just about banhams as theirs millions in london.

any help please

james

[mhole]

Ouch.

Banham's are either very simple, or very difficult, depending on whether or not they're double locked. I'm not aware of any course dealing with them specifically, but I would expect any good opening training to cover them.

They're most easily opened on the same principal as an Ingersol SC71, which can't be discussed in the open forum, but frankly, if you can't extrapolate it from that info, or don't know how to open an SC71l, you have no business trading yet.

[mh]

I believe Banham re-brands several different styles of locks, including a very interesting dimple style with balanced pin stacks on top and bottom.

[mhole]

This is the first I've ever heard of Banham rebranding - I'm certain yu're mistaken in this regard. It seems very unlikely that Banham are not the originators of the locks they use, especially since they hold the patent on them which restricts key duplication.

The dimple design with the balanced stacks is their current patent protected key, though you will also come across EVVA, ASSA, and MultiLock cylinders used in their older designs, which used a conventional euro style cylinder, with special cams or mounting screws. If you end up having to drill one of these, you're unlikely to have a replacement which will fit (we carry them in our van stock because Banham are so common in the London area).

[mh]

This is the first I've ever heard of Banham rebranding - I'm certain yu're mistaken in this regard. It seems very unlikely that Banham are not the originators of the locks they use, especially since they hold the patent on them which restricts key duplication.

The dimple design with the balanced stacks is their current patent protected key

Peter Field showed that "balanced pin" principle (a shallow hole on one side means a deep hole on the other side, there's little room to maneuver around with a pick) on a TESA-STS lock. That lock ist not on their current line at http://www.stslocks.com/en/default.asp anymore, though.

When I asked Peter about Banham he said they didn't manufacture their own locks.

Cheers,
mh

[aussielocky]

Current Banham locks are bespoke, ie made to their own unique design (who by is another matter). Previous locks however were made by Yale, and before that by Union in both cases being standard cylinders of each maker (in terms of the mechanism) in bespoke lockcases.

[greyman]

Agreed, Banham's sidebar lock was a Yale 5000. I don't know about their current dimple lock - it might be their own patent - I haven't seen it anywhere else, but that doesn't mean they invented it. Having said this, they make some of the most solid door latches/deadlocks I've ever seen - then again, I suppose they are needed in London.

[mh]

I believe this is the patent for the "balanced" dimple lock - US4660396
http://www.google.com/patents?id=bB43AA ... dq=4660396
The applicant company was TESA (Talleres de Escoriaza, S.A.) from Spain, now -guess what- part of the Assa Abloy Group.

The current locks would be T10P and T12P, see http://www.tesa.es/content/view/45/341/1/2/lang,en/

Cheers,
mh

[mhole]

Interesting, but the links provided are not the same as how the Banham cylinder is arranged. In my post where I provided photos of a Banham cylinder stripped down, Squelchtone provided this link to the patent docs:

http://nynex.s5.com/lp101/EP0892130B1.pdf

The balanced pin concept is the same, but the way the pins are sprung is very different. The patent for the Banham design is attributed to Brain Cowper, of New Malden, Surrey, and the patent is held by Banham.