"E-S" 3 lever mortice lock?

[Solomon]

Hey guys, I was given this by a lockie earlier today and I was wondering what kind of information I could get on it. He said it'd be a good idea to take it apart and see how everything works inside, which I plan to do, along with making some picks to try and open it (well, close it... it's already in the open position). Something struck me about it though:



What's that little wire sticking out? I doubt it's broken otherwise he wouldn't have given it to me, so I'm curious to know what it is. I also wanted to know what the information on the little round sticker means, and the name of the actual company who makes these. I didn't take a pic of the logo, but it's a big E S with a star in between. As you can tell, I'm very new to these.

One other thing, among the info stamped on it, it has a reversible bolt. What does this mean exactly, and how does it affect the picking process? Is this a good lock to start with when learning about mortice locks? Thanks for all the help, everyone.

[Olson Burry]

Pic too big! 800x600 is plenty big enough and I go for 640x480 usually.

That wire sticking out is part of the spring that should be holding the latch out,
which is operated by the square hole. This would be where a handle would fix
to the outsides of the door so it stays closed even though it is not locked. So either
the latch bolt is missing or it is inside somewhere. Anyway, you don't need that bit as
it has nothing to do with picking the lock.

I'm pretty sure "reversible bolt" just means you can put the sprung loaded bolt in
either way, so that you can push the door closed without turning the handle no matter
which way the door actually opens or which side of the door the lock is on.

I suggest you just take the screws out and have a look inside.

The process for picking these is to apply tension to the bolt, then move the levers with
another tool. You may need a considerable amount of tension on the bolt, however, in
order to get the levers to bind enough.

Here is a useful video on how to make up some lever wires.
I used some bicycle spokes.

Hope that helps. Good luck!

[Solomon]

My bad, resized the pic. Thanks for the info, olson. I remember watching that vid a while ago, will have to make do with a coathanger for the time being though... I'll get some piano wire next time I'm in town.

When you say it'll require considerable force, do you mean as opposed to picking a pin tumbler? That's what I'm guessing, although I guess I'll figure that out when it comes to picking it.

I was a bit dubious about taking it apart, but from looking at diagrams it doesn't seem like any springs are gonna go flying or anything so I'll get to work on that and have a little look. If I'm not sure about anything and it's not covered in the threads I found I'll blat some pics up and ask here.

[Olson Burry]

Considerable force, yes. Depending on how it is, probably more force than you'll be able to apply without the coathanger bending.

Worth a go though as you never know. Sometimes you can get an idea of how much force is needed by pressing on the bolt when it is out, instead
of tensioning it from the inside, and trying to get the levers to bind. Not a perfect method mind you.

When you take it apart, make sure it is flat and and take the lid off. When the lid is off the levers might want to ping out if you disturb them but if you
just put a finger on them they wont come off their little post.

All you need to do is take note of how they are sprung and it's easy to just put them back in, especially if there are only 3 of them. There might
be some spacers in between the levers as well but generally they're just plastic. It should all be reasonably obvious when you have a look really.

Go for it!

[Solomon]

Considerable force, yes. Depending on how it is, probably more force than you'll be able to apply without the coathanger bending.

Worth a go though as you never know. Sometimes you can get an idea of how much force is needed by pressing on the bolt when it is out, instead
of tensioning it from the inside, and trying to get the levers to bind. Not a perfect method mind you.

When you take it apart, make sure it is flat and and take the lid off. When the lid is off the levers might want to ping out if you disturb them but if you
just put a finger on them they wont come off their little post.

All you need to do is take note of how they are sprung and it's easy to just put them back in, especially if there are only 3 of them. There might
be some spacers in between the levers as well but generally they're just plastic. It should all be reasonably obvious when you have a look really.

Go for it!

Yep! It was a doddle to figure this thing out... once I got the faceplate off I just maneuvered everything with my (now oily) fingers... it does take a fair bit of force to throw the bolt, but that aside I imagine this is gonna be easier than picking a pin tumbler.


As you can see, I managed to get it to the closed position using my fingers. Now it's time to put it back together and see if I can make some tools for it. Can you tell me what that broken bit in the top right of the image is? It was connected to the circular bit, which I also have no idea what is for.

One other thing, are mortice locks with curtains considered advanced material? He was showing me a couple in the shop and explained how to bypass them without the specialised tools, but I don't really wanna talk too much about it if it's restricted to the advanced forums.

[Olson Burry]

The bit that has fallen out is just the thing that used retract the sprung loaded bolt that is missing, it changes the turning
force of the handle into lateral movement. Again, the fact it is missing doesn't matter at all so far as picking goes.

Curtain picking and lever locks in general aren't considered advanced unless they're on safes or the like so whatever
you've found out will be fine to share.

Cheers!

[Solomon]

The bit that has fallen out is just the thing that used retract the sprung loaded bolt that is missing, it changes the turning
force of the handle into lateral movement. Again, the fact it is missing doesn't matter at all so far as picking goes.

Curtain picking and lever locks in general aren't considered advanced unless they're on safes or the like so whatever
you've found out will be fine to share.

Cheers!

Oh, cool. I was just wondering because the ones with curtains have a little gap in the faceplate which allows you to manipulate the levers with a screwdriver when a hole is drilled through the door... it got me thinking, why do curtained locks have this if they're supposedly higher security, whereas standard mortice locks have a completely solid faceplate?

As a quick update, I'm not having any luck picking this yet. I need to get myself a desktop vice.

Oh yeah and sorry about the first pic, I resized it but it seems to be changing back to the original size every once in a while for some reason. It could just be my cookies, but I dunno.

[femurat]

... Here is a useful video on how to make up some lever wires. ...

Thanks a lot for this link, it was useful. Also other jaydorner's videos are interesting.
How about adding it to this topic?
I'll let you decide, since you suggested the video.

Cheers

[exspook]

hi, i dont know what tools you have but the best way is to cut a section out of the front of the lock case so you can see the levers moving when you manipulate them.

two pieces of bent steel wire are excellent, try using good quality piano wire from a model shop about 1.6mm diameter

Dave

[Solomon]

hi, i dont know what tools you have but the best way is to cut a section out of the front of the lock case so you can see the levers moving when you manipulate them.

two pieces of bent steel wire are excellent, try using good quality piano wire from a model shop about 1.6mm diameter

Dave

I dunno if he wants this back or not, so I'm not gonna modify it just yet. I saw a thread where someone made a plexiglass faceplate for one, which I thought was pretty nifty, so I'll see if I can get something like that made. And yeah, I heard piano wire is the best stuff to use so I'm definately gonna get some of that next time I get the chance.

I have a bit of trouble with the wire slipping off the levers, so I was thinking of making a tool with a shallow groove on the tip. I figure this will give me a good grip around the levers and let me push them upwards quite easily without the wire slipping. Thoughts on this?

[exspook]

making a "plexiglas" cover for one of these would be a mare mate....

make sure the ends of the wire are cut nice square and de burred and wide enough (1.60mm)

bike spokes are a classic to start with...top tip

Dave

[mhole]

E*S is the logo for the company Eurospec. They sre cheap and cheerfulN and commonly used by builders in new builds. What you have is a sash lock, which means it comprises a sprung latch operated by a lever or knob in the same case as a deadbolt.

As for the question about curtained mortice locks; peepholes are rare on newer BS3621 locks, and are really only found on older locks. Most modern designs have no peephole, and all moving parts which could be manipulated are covered by a hardened steel plate to make them hard to get at without TC tipped drllls. Info on drilling locks is considered advanced as it is destructive opening or bypass.