new style Master Combo-lock Key Making

[frollard]

Hello.

I took apart my old lock a while back, wanting to be able to make a key for it, to see how its done.

(its the kind that has serial 60089/v689)

I'm told they ALL take the same key.

When taking the plug out of the cylinder I accidentally dumped the middle 2 keypins onto the floor, and have since lost the order completely.
(the plug is held into the cylinder by a 'riveting' process, where they mushroom out the back end of the plug, so its 'there forever'. I lost the pins when grinding that down, and the plug popped out. :S

I'm asking: there are 2 medium pins, 1 high, and one low. - from looking into the keyway, what order do the pins go? (if someone has a pic of a key they made that'd be EXCELLENT)

Lastly: What keyway IS it? I'm told its a master padlock key that has had the bottom filed off of it.

THANKS in advance

Last note: as I can imagine you would suspect, I'm not making this key to break into other locks, merely as a lockout tool. The only people around here who use master combos are high school lockers - utterly useless to me since I graduated from college a year ago

[TOWCH]

Master padlock:http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/TOWCH2/padkeyway.jpg
Master combo:http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/TOWCH2/combokeyway.jpg

A standard master padlock keyblank with the head/handle thing cut off and flipped, with the top of the key filed down to about half standard height would make a funtional keyblank I think, I'll have to pick one up and try it next time I'm at the hardware store. If you try it post your results and let me know how it works. As for making the key I suggest keeping the key pins, getting another one of those locks and just picking it. When the cylinder is rotated, just feel the pins with a hook and find out which one is the longest, which one is shortest, ect. Then use the order to organize your keypins into the proper order and then file to custom key blank to the proper lengths. I've been having trouble picking mine but I'll give it another shot and post the length order if I do get it.

[randmguy]

No frollard they are not all the same key. These locks are equipped with a cylinder to override the combination mechanism if the combination is forgotten or if the lock is not removed at the end of the year. Each series of lock has its own bitting for the override key. That way no one has to worry about the staff from School A opening lockers at School B. The key blank is usually an Ilco 1092VR. Good luck finding this one at a hardware store. You've got zero chance of buying one ,cut or uncut, from any reputable locksmith. The only application I'm aware of for these keys is for Master Institutional combination padlocks.

[Murph]

I have found those Master Combos with the keyway a cinch to pick, just keep the tension very very light. That was the first lock I ever picked.

[frollard]

mine's had putty, peanut butter, paint, ink and everything in that keyway, picking it was NOT fun.

(had to take the cylinder out of the lock, and run the rake pick completely through the plug repeatedly before it turned. not fun).

and thats the thing - I have several 'institutional' locks, with the same code available to me, and I wanted to be able to make a key.

[Murph]

How about spraying a fast drying solvent like the kind used for electronics? "Soak" the cylinder real good then add a lock lubricant? Or, you could use the canned air used for cleaning computer keyboards and components. Just a couple thoughts here.