upvc door locks

[tolwoods]

im looking for info and diagrams on how door locks mechanism work on upvc doors any help would be appericated

[illusion]

Do you mean the multi-points?

If you're talking about cylinders then it's a very vague question...

[tolwoods]

im looking for info on multi point and cylinders on how to remove and fit new ones

[Squelchtone]

I found an article about burgulars 'snapping' these locks.. Is this the same as what everyone else calls 'bumping' ?

here's the article

http://www.ciaalarms.co.uk/break_secure_cylinders.htm

The pictures suggest people are popping the european profile locks right out and manually opening the multilocks once the lock cylinder is removed. Interesting.

I have found several links, perhaps these will help you measure and fit new ones.

http://www.upvcdoorlocks.co.uk/

http://www.multipointlocks.co.uk/

Best Regards,

Squelchtone

[parapilot]

I found an article about burgulars 'snapping' these locks.. Is this the same as what everyone else calls 'bumping' ?

No it's different. It's bypassing so not discussed here

[lockedin]

No it isn't bumping. Due to a structural weakness in some locks they can literally snap the lock broken, however there are adjustments that can be installed after-market to prevent this.

[mh]

im looking for info on multi point and cylinders on how to remove and fit new ones

Most multi point locking mechanisms I've seen use Euro cylinders, and they are very easy to remove and replace. One long screw holds them, and the key needs to be turned so that you can pull the Euro cylinder out of the mortice lock.
If you look a the replacement cylnder, you will immediately understand the concept.

If that's your first contact to Euro cylinders, note that they need to be ordered in the correct length.

And if that doesn't answer the question, please give more specifics about the lock.

Cheers,
mh

[toomush2drink]

Multi points work by a system of a sliding piece which operates hooks or mushroom rollers etc. Most are operated directly by the handle not the cylinder and by lifting the handle upwards.
Some do operate the multipoint locking via the cylinder but a lot are not replaceable as they arent that reliable and break due to the amount of pressure on the cams or internal cogs etc.
Some are automatic deadlocking as soon as you lift the handle others need you to lift the handle then turn the key to deadlock.Some have what is known as a split spindle or through spindle.The split spindle maens the latch can only be retracted on the outside by the key but by the handle on the inside.A thorugh spindle allowsthe latch to be retracted from both sides, normally you find these on a backdoor but are becoming more common on front doors of new builds to help comply with DDA regulations etc.

I hope this is the answer you were looking for.

[workstation]

Very interesting, Toomush

Can you give us an example of one that operates by the cylinder? Do they work on one 360 degree turn, or do they need several, like the Italian style ones with barrel bolts for steel doors?

Likewise, an example of one that deadlocks on lifting the handle without the use of the key would be very interesting.

I do hate those split spindle locks. The outside handle is completely useless. It's like having a nightlatch with a "handle"! Ridiculous. Some even have a snib on the concealed edge of the door. (Right where you can't use it to bolt the door shut). Why can't they make them work like American entry leversets - where the function of the outer handle can be toggled from inside? (Rhetorical question - obviously they could if they thought about it.)

Incidentally, I'm sure that in rural/suburban areas, a through spindle has always been more common, even on the front door. Otherwise, the whole world would have surely gone mad.

[toomush2drink]

Your right workstation about the 360 turns, basically you turn those types 360 twice to engage the rollers, the problems come when the keeps are out of alignment and the pressure to engage them is on the the internal cog which the cam moves around, they just snap.
I personally think split spindles are much better as i get a lot of calls from customers who have through spindles on the front doors and it means anyone can just walk in behind them, most want an additional nightlatch fitted if possible.A lot of the mechs can actually be set up as a split spindle by just changing the spindles but not all of them allow this. I opened one yesterday fitted to a wooden door and this had a through spindle so ended up fitting a nightlatch too after the customer expressed concerns over it.
Think about it from a security point of view, your female and go up to your flat or house with a load of shopping, its dark and they open the door then grab the bags then go in.Most people will take the bags to the kitchen etc before going back to lock the door, if they remember.This allows someone else to enter the property behind them, a standard nightlatch or split spindle prevents this senario.
Other customers have expressed concern they have forgot to lock the door because the phone rang as they got in etc and the next morning realised anyone could have walked in to their horror, its a silly set up for front doors.

[mh]

That's the system on my front door, quite robust, but it's not a commercial environment, of course:
http://www.kfv.de/index.php?id=14&L=1

mh

[workstation]

Toomush,

I have no problem with optionally automatic locks, like US knob- and leversets. Indeed, I like them very much.

Nightlatches I find annoying if, say, working in the front garden, bringing in furniture etc. You've two options if you don't want them to lock: let the door swing (annoying, and it looks terrible), or fit another latch. If you fit another latch, you now have to put down your shopping so as to have both hands free in order to get in. Nevertheless, the annoyance of nightlatches is excusable - they are what they are: nightlatches.

With the PVC-style locks that have a handle on the outside, however, there's no excuse. The really needs to be a way to switch easily between both types of functionality - like the button on a knobset.

I think part of the irritation stems ultimately from the fact that the multi-point should aesthetically and logically be the only lock on the door, else what's the point?

The other thing that annoys me about them is that all that is securing the door automatically is the latchbolt, or so I believe; correct me if I'm wrong. I realize it's probably not feasable to spring the whole mechanism, but they could at least have a proper automatic deadbolt or something.

Don't get me started on the fact that you can't "bolt" the door. Any keyholder (or person picking the back door cylinder) can always get in, unless you leave the key in the door, in which case, you've left the key in the door, and anyone that breaks in can easily get out! It wouldn't be hard to add the desired functionality, either. For example, you could do it with the handle, like a privacy latch.

I suppose I just want the ultimate lock boltwork.

[mh]

I suppose I just want the ultimate lock boltwork.

How about this? http://www.kfv.de/fileadmin/Downloads/P ... AS2750.pdf
mh

[workstation]

Thanks, mh

Three separate latches is a good idea, but I wonder how much of an effort it is to withdraw them from outside with the key. I would like a lock whereby on insertion (and obviously slight turning) of the key, the outer handle becomes usable. This would allow each of the hookbolts and deadbolts to be sprung, as there would be enough leverage to push them down.

The other stuff could probably be handled by the handles, as it were.

[toomush2drink]

Workstation as i mentioned before some multipoints do automatically deadlock when you close them others only need you to lift the handle to auto deadlock so maybe thats what you need.The new era multipoint deadlocks on closing but can be opened by key or remote control or any other access control switch system. http://www.era-security.com/access.html
As everything there is a downside you will need a letterbox guard for sure .
You can also get multipoints with bolts you slide across at night for additional security but i personally prefer sash jammers.