Schlage Primus

by **Dent** » 21 Mar 2005 7:21

Ok, so anyway my school has a full line of primus cynlinders and as such, I'm intrested in picking them.

I've read the Schlage manual and understand that there are 6 possibilities for each sidebar pin of the key. Deep, Shallow and Left/right/Center.

I've heard that the best way to pick these is to cut down a key into half so that it will operate the sidebar.... I have a key that gives me the correct code for my school's key, but I can't get a spare one to hack away at.

I have spare blanks of the primus keyway, does anyone know how you would go about drilling/filing your own side bits? The cuts are pretty round in order for the sidebar pins to glide over easily, don't know if you could hand file that or how you would...

Also, how would you go about picking this without the half-key as a tension wrench?

What tool would you use to manipulate the sidebar pins, and how would you rotate each pin? how would you tell when each pin is "set" for the sidebar?

Can you keep the sidebar engaged by tension while you pick the pins???

How long would this take and what kind of tools would you need?

Any help on tackling this beast of a lock would be much appricated

by **Dent** » 21 Mar 2005 7:33

Small edit:

I don't have any primus blanks... I incorrectly mixed up some other schlage key blanks and didn't relize(obvious I know) that the Primus has special biting on one of the wards...

by **Exodus5000** » 21 Mar 2005 14:32

Schalge Primus locks are no small feat. The trick is you have to get all 5 of the sidebar pins in the correct position and all 6 standard pins picked for it to open. The 6 standard pins will stay picked with tension from your wrench, the sidebar pins however wont.

Be careful not to mix up schlage primus with schlage everest. Everest only required a pin in the back of the lock to be set with part of the key, this is not the case in primus.

These locks are close to being on par with medeco for pick resistance in my opinion. Try to think of some creative methods to deal with those sidebar pins.

by **stick** » 21 Mar 2005 18:40

After you've picked your school's locks, be sure to brag about it to the teachers, principal, and local authorities. I'm sure they'll love you and throw a parade in your honor. Right after you've been fined, jailed, or both.

by **CaptHook** » 21 Mar 2005 19:09

My suggestion would be to drop this topic, as you should not be getting any help here.

Chuck

by **digital_blue** » 21 Mar 2005 19:22

Thanks Capt Hook! You beat me to it!

Let's not all jump in here to teach someone how to break the lock. Dent, when you buy yourself a primus lock, feel free to come back here with questions. In the mean time, please refrain from picking locks that are not yours to pick, and if you must do it, please refrain from posting here about it. Just trying to protect the integrity of our hobby here.

db

by **Dent** » 21 Mar 2005 20:30

1: I am not an idiot and I'm not going to brag. And even if they were to trace this back to a message board, posting on the internet that you are about to commit an illegal activity or that you already did is hardly enough evidence to actually convict you of a crime. Also we don't have a principal and teachers, we have a president and proffesors...geez

2: I have a spare primus cynlinder to play with as I work at the school(student worker) The sibebars are all the same and I have them read as per the schlage guide.

3: I already have the keys to everyone I'd even think about picking, but just no spare keys(they keep tabs on them which is good).

4: Wasn't the MIT guide all about using lockpicking to non-destructively explore their school campus? Don't you think it is hypocritical to guide everyone to a source that preaches breaking into your own school's locks to explore and then tell someone they are doing something wrong when they try to do the same?

5: Can any of you please tell me of another website that would be helpful to someone who is looking to further their knowledge of the hobby/sport?

by **stick** » 21 Mar 2005 20:56

The MIT guide doesn't preach breaking into restricted areas, it only states that it's purpose was to teach members of a club at MIT how to pick locks in order that they might do so. However, it's still illegal.

by **master in training** » 21 Mar 2005 21:18

dent, if you are caught picking a lock and you dont have written permission from the legal owner, you are liable to be prosecuted as breaking and entering.

i know you said you're not stupid, no-one said you were, but no-one will endorse anything illegal here either.

by **digital_blue** » 22 Mar 2005 0:32

Ok... up on my soapbox I go....

Dent wrote:1: I am not an idiot and I'm not going to brag. And even if they were to trace this back to a message board, posting on the internet that you are about to commit an illegal activity or that you already did is hardly enough evidence to actually convict you of a crime.

Hardly the point. There is a conception amongst many non-lockpickers that we must be doing this for some untoward reason. I feel we all owe it to a whole community of lockpickers to uphold the strictest moral stance. Every time a hobby lockpicker gets caught picking a lock he shouldn't he is doing a disservice to the whole group (in the "See I told you they were up to no good" kind of mentality). You may not like it, but it is a fact. I think that if this hobby is ever to gain a widespread exceptance it will only come with people being comforable about what we do. We want law enforcement on our side. We want school administrations on our side. For god sake don't screw it up 'cause you cant play by the rules.

And then you wrote:2: I have a spare primus cynlinder to play with as I work at the school(student worker) The sibebars are all the same and I have them read as per the schlage guide.

Good. If it is yours (ie: you own it) pick to your hearts content.

Next you wrote:3: I already have the keys to everyone I'd even think about picking, but just no spare keys(they keep tabs on them which is good).

Not at all the point. You were given those keys in trust. If you want to pick the locks just for fun, just go get yourself expressed permission from the admins. I'm sure they won't mind, right?

And you also wrote:4: Wasn't the MIT guide all about using lockpicking to non-destructively explore their school campus? Don't you think it is hypocritical to guide everyone to a source that preaches breaking into your own school's locks to explore and then tell someone they are doing something wrong when they try to do the same?

No. I don't give a rats rear end what the purpose of the original document was. It happens to be, at the moment, the most comprehensive freely available resource on the topic. You, as an individual, can do whatever you like with the info. You, as a member of this community, have a responsibilty to all of us. Obviously, I'm not going to know if you're off committing crimes with the knowledge you gain here, but I sure as heck am going to stand up and say something when you make it known around here. I owe that to every one here who makes this community work and has an interest in seeing it grow.

And now I step back down off the soapbox.

db

by **Exodus5000** » 22 Mar 2005 1:11

They're right, you shouldn't be picking locks that aren't yours.
Take solace in knowing you probably wouldn't have been able to pick it anyways.

I suggest everyone clam up know before this degrades into a flame fit. I remember other threads on primus's you can look at Dent if you're still interested, some of which I started if I remember correctly.

by **zekeo** » 22 Mar 2005 1:52

I think that the only ethical standard for whether one should be able to pick a lock is whether or not you have the key. For example, under DB's logic, it would be illegal to pick the front door of your apartment or rented house without the express permission of the landlord. Just an attempt to bring some clarity to these muddy ethical waters.

To repeat: if you have the key, it's ok to pick. (of corse if you did any damage to the lock you would be honest and pay to replace it.

by **TOWCH** » 22 Mar 2005 2:00

I don't know if that advise is sound on legal grounds but I can't see why anyone would have a problem with you picking a lock you have the key to.

by **digital_blue** » 22 Mar 2005 7:50

TOWCH wrote:...I can't see why anyone would have a problem with you picking a lock you have the key to.

Well, that may be the case, but I don't think it excuses getting permission. I can think of all kinds of reasons why ppl might be uncomfortable with someone picking locks in their establishment even if that person was a legitimate key holder. And I really don't think there's anything muddy about this. If you're pretty darned sure that the legal owner wouldn't mind, just ask their permission. If you're not willing to ask permission I suspect it is becuase you know the answer.

See? Simple as that... no muddiness at all.

As for your apartment door, I still stand by my premise. Especially considering that excessive picking can put wear on a lock on both the pins and springs. If I owned your apartment and you asked me if you could pick the lock, I would politely ask you to go buy your own locks to pick. You are not the one responsible for replacing thta lock when it gets worn out.

I know it isn't always convenient to uphold the strictest of moral positions when it comes to lockpicking, but I am totally convinced that it is needed if we are to advance this hobby.

db

by **Jimmie** » 22 Mar 2005 9:47

have you tried to "bump" it ?

cause this lock looks more or less like the Assa twin ... unfortunately I have not one to test

I know and I've seen the Assa twin bumps opened (if you have the right side bar which is different according to the country you're living or it is a special sidebar bought by a smith to the cie and reserved only for sale by the smith owner)

I don't know if a smith can buy a special reserved sidebar to Schlage Primus

Schlage Primus

Schlage Primus

Who is online