Gerda titan ZX

[TOWCH]

Oops, ment to copy that to a PM window. It's fairly harmless metal working advice though so I'm not gonna lose sleep over it. Haven't even tested it myself yet.

[peacefullockie]

so hoe about if we get hold of some keys and make a bumpkey out of them?

[greyman]

Looks a lot like the Austrian Helason lock. I posted a picture of one a while back on the guess the lock thread. Now I'm wondering who invented it first?

[Shrub]

2 Shrub
Please!!!Please!!!Please!!!
Do not erase please help if you can

If its against forum rules theres no amount of please's in the world that would allow me to leave sensitive information in the open forums,

As regards your question,
For very thin small tubeing you can use syringe needles, for all other material you need to find a model shop and see what they have or start ordering from the internet from a steel supplier,

Try the local model shop then online model shops then online steel suppliers,

Im guessing you would want stainless steel and it needs to be seemless,
Tube is sold by the internal diameter so if somthing says the tube is 6mm it means its inside diameter is 6mm,

[raimundo]

the key appears to be a dimple type key fitted to a round keyway, with an external pickup for turning the cylinder, dimples come from several directions as the key has dimples in various orientations, as well as the inlind bible seen in the cylinder. A pick for this would also be round, and it may be simply lathed into a round version of the matador type of pick or you could create variations around the pick so that some are high, and other areas are low, Such a shape lends itself to interesting mechanization, you cold use a motor like a hammerdrill that would rotate the pick while bumping the pins, the key to the whole thing would be the tensor which would fit the slot to turn the plug, but would have a hole through it that the pick works through, independently of the tensor.
this lock would be much more secure if the plug pickup,(tensioning point) were deep in the keyway, such as a D profile on the tip of the key, rather than on the outside of the lock where its easy to design a tensor with a hole through it for the pick. All this is speculation based on what I see in the photos.

[peacefullockie]

Very good idea there.
that sounds like a good pathe to take.
with that kind of speed all the pins are bound to find the shearlin at one point.
i like it but putting it into practice is another thing

well done on that

when i get time and a gerda ill try it

[Libris]

As for bumping, I edited in paint your original picture to show what I am thinking of.



I suck at paint, but you should get the idea.
I think this should be the real bumpkey.

[pickmeister]

That lock is certainly impressive
I had only heard about Gerde before but after seeing one of their locks disassembled I have to say I am very impressed with their products...now to see if we can make some tools for them
Does anyone know the price of these locks? Their website just refers me to a phone number to locate a supplier.

[atrix]

2 Shrub
thanks for help I will try to find by online steel suppliers
2 raimundo
this lock would be much more secure if the plug pickup,(tensioning point) were deep in the keyway
http://www.polyvector.spb.ru/item.php?id=3
http://www.locks.ru/images/photo/trial/barier2.jpg
http://www.kriminalist.com/images/barier4/4.jpg
in this lock tensioning point is in the keyway and pins are located from 8 sides gerda it has only 4 sides with pins and 4 antidriling pins

and 1 link about gerda
http://www.kriminalist.com/gerda.htm
2 Libris
I do not think that this key it will work,too long a motion

and standart bumpkey cutting I think it will give the necessary result

2 pickmeister
for my lock I paid 70$ there are 3 forms : short key 60$ , long key(my) 70$ ,extra long key75-80$.
And key blank 8-10$

[TOWCH]

My suggestion would be an adjustable shoulder bumpkey with V cuts just for simplicity sake. I would "rib" the key for the cuts so I could do it in a lathe but if that's not possible there are other options of course.

[greyman]

pickmeister - I like your animated images!

However I'm not sure that the sawtooth one is an accurate representation of how a bump key works. The lower pin would not go down before the top pin, which has the additional spring tension to force it down. Bumping works by transfer of energy via the pins - the bottom pin transfers it straight to the top pin, which moves up in response against the tension of the driver spring.

[doppiamappa]

Hello ,
is few monts by play with gerda tytan zx serie. Discovered that there is no way for bump and impression methods. Actualy on the impression I get some poor results but dont have done one clear opening.
Those locks are many difused in my country and at the e nd of the storry I have discovered a fantastic way to open them whith in 10 min. Obviously cant share all process at the public session.
Conclussion : All gerdas zx serie / antipick pins/ dont merit the level 7 of the security.They have few exploits and can be manipolated with my tool after few hours of training.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zOQywFRtVKA

[Rickthepick]

Id be interested to see how you opened one of these.

I tried picking using a special tension wrench and a circular type of 'bump key' that i just spun in the keyway with a drill on slow speed. it set a lot of the pins but i didnt really put much time into it as the lock was on loan.

[kerti]

Id be interested to see how you opened one of these.

.

Some people think that his tool is fake.
But it is very interesting how that tool works.