Bumping Medeco

by **globallockytoo** » 27 Jul 2007 23:27

Eyes_Only wrote:I think what you may be describing there could be a Medeco cam lock of some kind. If it is then bumping probably wouldn't work. Although I don't take trips in elevators too often so I couldn't really be sure what kind of locking mechanism they use there.

Nothing personal guys, but it is a well known fact that Medeco cam locks are NOT bump proof. These locks do not have sidebar technology and have and are being bumped regularly. That being said, Medeco keyblanks are restricted so getting blanks is difficult still.

by **JackNco** » 28 Jul 2007 0:14

why would you need a blank. u just need a key.

by **globallockytoo** » 28 Jul 2007 2:09

JackNco wrote:why would you need a blank. u just need a key.

You are quite correct, however altering an existing key, maintaining the existing angles is somewhat difficult.

by **JackNco** » 28 Jul 2007 2:15

Ive honestly never tried cutting a medeco key by hand. the standard keys ive cut are bad enough. But i guess it would be.

by **zeke79** » 28 Jul 2007 2:15

You are very right there global. That is how I done my medeco bumping video. I altered a working key with a file by hand. It took some time for sure.

by **kissnatcher1** » 28 Jul 2007 10:32

Well from what i have seen and read I belive that bumping works better on the higher end locks $$...I may be wrong as i dont personally use the bumpkeys i have played with them just not alot.If im wrong im sure someone will let me know

by **nekret** » 28 Jul 2007 12:41

kissnatcher1 wrote:Well from what i have seen and read I belive that bumping works better on the higher end locks $$...I may be wrong as i dont personally use the bumpkeys i have played with them just not alot.If im wrong im sure someone will let me know

Supposedly the reason for this is that higher end locks have tighter tolerances and therefor allow more energy to be transfered into the pins that would normally be lost to friction on just a few pins. However this is just a theory I've heard on the subject and seems to be accurate as I've tested bumping on kwikset, schlage and master cylinders. kwiksets and masters are known to have some of the most slop in the industry and to me they are more difficult to bump than the schlages.

by **Eyes_Only** » 28 Jul 2007 13:01

globallockytoo wrote:
Eyes_Only wrote:I think what you may be describing there could be a Medeco cam lock of some kind. If it is then bumping probably wouldn't work. Although I don't take trips in elevators too often so I couldn't really be sure what kind of locking mechanism they use there.

Nothing personal guys, but it is a well known fact that Medeco cam locks are NOT bump proof. These locks do not have sidebar technology and have and are being bumped regularly. That being said, Medeco keyblanks are restricted so getting blanks is difficult still.

I thought the cam locks Medeco makes didn't use pin stacks but kind of worked like the BiLock.

by **mercurial** » 28 Jul 2007 19:52

Eyes_Only wrote:
globallockytoo wrote:
Eyes_Only wrote:I think what you may be describing there could be a Medeco cam lock of some kind. If it is then bumping probably wouldn't work. Although I don't take trips in elevators too often so I couldn't really be sure what kind of locking mechanism they use there.

Nothing personal guys, but it is a well known fact that Medeco cam locks are NOT bump proof. These locks do not have sidebar technology and have and are being bumped regularly. That being said, Medeco keyblanks are restricted so getting blanks is difficult still.

I thought the cam locks Medeco makes didn't use pin stacks but kind of worked like the BiLock.

Yes the Medeco camlock is somewhat similar in principle to BiLock. Both have no top pins, both employ a side-bar (two in the case of BiLock).

globallockytoo - Medeco cam locks most certainly DO have a sidebar (it is the ONLY locking element in the lock). It is driver pins that the Medeco camlock doesn't have, it only has key-pins.

I have never tried to bump a Medeco cam lock, but I doubt they can be bumped open easily. I don't want to go into detail, as discussion along these lines will fast become advanced forum material.

...Mark

by **Gordon Airporte** » 28 Jul 2007 20:02

There's no way to bump a Medeco cam lock because, as has been noted, there is only one pin per chamber, thus nothing to separate at the shear line. The shear line is blocked only by the sidebar which can retract when its fingers fit into holes in the pins. The holes are drilled into the sides of the pins such that the pins need to be both lifted and rotated to align the hole with the corresponding sidebar finger.
(Just regurgitating what raimundo said in another thread, but that made it clear for me.)

by **Eyes_Only** » 28 Jul 2007 20:25

I just pulled out the plug on my Medeco cam lock to make sure I wasn't tripping. There certainly is a sidebar in there alright. :wink:

by **globallockytoo** » 29 Jul 2007 0:40

Well...it seems the doubting thomas' have returned with their usual unfounded sceptism....the fact that multiple Medeco cylinders were, in reality bumped open by various notable locksmiths at ALOA...and it was captured on film for all to see is testament to this fact.

There will always be those that doubt facts, even when presented with direct evidence. Keep living with your "security through obscurity" attitude...the rest of the world have faith in some respected authorities...but you go ahead and keep saying it cant be done...because you cant do it....I've done it...so have others on this forum...and so have locksmiths at the ALOA convention.

Of course...if it pays for you to believe BS so you can sell or buy a product then go right ahead.

We know the truth....

There are only two (2) fully guaranteed bump proof cylinders currently available on the US market.....Bilock and Abloy!

by **globallockytoo** » 29 Jul 2007 0:43

I stand corrected on the Medeco camlock...it does indeed have a side bar...but it can and is being bumped open...contrary to the doubting thomas' in here.

by **Squelchtone** » 29 Jul 2007 0:49

globallockytoo wrote:I stand corrected on the Medeco camlock...it does indeed have a side bar...but it can and is being bumped open...contrary to the doubting thomas' in here.

ok.. just a question.. at ALOA.. are they bumping with prior knowledge of the key cut angles for each pin position?

I dont see how it could be bumped otherwise, since the Newtonian rules of physics do not apply to correctly rotate an object while pushing on it.

it would be very interesting if a medeco could be bumped without knowing the angle cuts.

talk to you soon,

Squelchtone

by **globallockytoo** » 29 Jul 2007 5:56

squelchtone wrote:
globallockytoo wrote:I stand corrected on the Medeco camlock...it does indeed have a side bar...but it can and is being bumped open...contrary to the doubting thomas' in here.

ok.. just a question.. at ALOA.. are they bumping with prior knowledge of the key cut angles for each pin position?

I dont see how it could be bumped otherwise, since the Newtonian rules of physics do not apply to correctly rotate an object while pushing on it.

it would be very interesting if a medeco could be bumped without knowing the angle cuts.

talk to you soon,

Squelchtone

Unfortunately, actual discussion of the technique in the public forum would be against this sites TOU....so i am not at liberty to comment there...and I would prefer to not have the thread locked...so please stop asking technical questions....as they will not be answered...and the thread will get locked...which will end a great conversation.

Suffice to say....it is time for the doubting thomas' to put it back in their pants and zip it up....it's all this hands on d*** attitude that promoted alleged benefits of a product that do not exist....as proved to the very profession (or the respected authorities of that profession) that guard peoples security with devices of a security nature.

Rock on Bilock! The only fully guaranteed bump proof pin tumbler system on the current US market!

Bumping Medeco

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