Lock Picking 101 Forum
A community dedicated to the fun and ethical hobby of lock picking.
       

Lock Picking 101 Home
Login
Profile
Members
Forum Rules
Frequent Forum Questions
SEARCH
View New Posts
View Active Topics


Live Chat on Discord
LP101 Forum Chat
Keypicking Forum Chat
Reddit r/lockpicking Chat



Learn How to Pick Locks
FAQs & General Questions
Got Beginner Questions?
Pick-Fu [Intermediate Level]


Ask a Locksmith
This Old Lock
This Old Safe
What Lock Should I Buy?



Hardware
Locks
Lock Patents
Lock Picks
Lock Bumping
Lock Impressioning
Lock Pick Guns, Snappers
European Locks & Picks
The Machine Shop
The Open Source Lock
Handcuffs


Member Spotlight
Member Introductions
Member Lock Collections
Member Social Media


Off Topic
General Chatter
Other Puzzles


Locksmith Business Info
Training & Licensing
Running a Business
Keyways & Key Blanks
Key Machines
Master Keyed Systems
Closers and Crash Bars
Life Safety Compliance
Electronic Locks & Access
Locksmith Supplies
Locksmith Lounge


Buy Sell Trade
Buy - Sell - Trade
It came from Ebay!


Advanced Topics
Membership Information
Special Access Required:
High Security Locks
Vending Locks
Advanced Lock Pick Tools
Bypass Techniques
Safes & Safe Locks
Automotive Entry & Tools
Advanced Buy/Sell/Trade


Locksport Groups
Locksport Local
Chapter President's Office
Locksport Board Room
 

The Crankshaft lock design

Information about locks themselves. Questions, tips and lock diagram information should be posted here.

Re: The Crankshaft lock design

Postby prevariikation » 23 Sep 2021 16:19

This lock idea is super cool :) Coming up with a new idea while being aware of manufacturing costs and restrictions is a heck of a challenge..

How are the number of distinct bittings calculated in the provisional patent? I'm guessing total bittings = (8 wafers)^(4 cuts) - (number violating MAC restrictions)? What is the effective MAC of the system? It seems like there's a tradeoff between the keyway size, ideally small to constrain lockpicking tools, versus the MAC, to preserve physical continuity of the key.

And I feel like you've addressed disadvantages of the leaf springs pretty well, but I had a couple thoughts.
  1. It seems like the sidebar can be directly accessed underneath the wafers, and I think it's possible to (weakly) reverse-bias the binding order. By pushing the front end of the sidebar down using an L-shaped tool slipped between the front wafer and lock body, tensioning the lock should cause the rear wafers to bind first, as only the rear spring will be compressed. I am not sure if my logic is sound here.
  2. Since the cutout in the bottom of the leaf spring needs to be large enough to accomodate the full sidebar (like a true gate,) one might be able to perform keyspace reduction by pushing a wire into the gap and feeling middle-to-back and middle-to-front for gate positions. In particular, this attack gains effectiveness if a manufacturer opts for only one false gate. Depending on false gate layout, one might be able to further eliminate false gates by applying MAC restrictions.
Totally unrelated, but has anyone built a working prototype? The animation is incredibly informative and I think this mechanism would be wonderfully cool to see in person too.
she/her/hers
User avatar
prevariikation
 
Posts: 150
Joined: 22 Feb 2021 0:44

Re: The Crankshaft lock design

Postby Yehonatan Knoll » 24 Sep 2021 9:32

Thanks prevariikation,
Calculating the number of distinct bittings for key of length n, B(n), is done through recursion, relative to B(n-1). It's a non trivial combinatorial problem I can elaborate on if math is your thing. B(n) grows very rapidly with n but still sub exponentially.

Your method from point (1) won't work; pushing down on the front of the sidebar would resist tensioning. Nevertheless, if you could insert a tool *from the outside*, reaching the rear end of the sidebar and lifting it, this could indeed pose a problem. You are correct on point (2) but note that, the choice of locating the spring in the middle, is just to help with tolerances stack-up. And at the back, you could have a step, mimicking that of the wafers in fig. 11, as part of the cylinder.

I have not produced a working prototype yet. Too busy with other things. But I do think it could make a cool premium lock/cylinder. Should you or or anyone else here want to collaborate - I'll be glad.
Yehonatan Knoll
 
Posts: 15
Joined: 28 Aug 2019 5:43

Re: The Crankshaft lock design

Postby prevariikation » 24 Sep 2021 12:49

Yehonatan Knoll wrote:Calculating the number of distinct bittings for key of length n, B(n), is done through recursion, relative to B(n-1). It's a non trivial combinatorial problem I can elaborate on if math is your thing.

That'd be cool 8) I've messed around with combinatorics a bit.

Good to know that (1) isn't workable. Getting sidebar access from outside would difficult. And as you said for (2), there are easy modifications to make the leaf spring configuration more robust.

Yehonatan Knoll wrote:I have not produced a working prototype yet. Too busy with other things. But I do think it could make a cool premium lock/cylinder. Should you or or anyone else here want to collaborate - I'll be glad.

I wish I had the machining skills! I'll be on the lookout for anyone who can though.
she/her/hers
User avatar
prevariikation
 
Posts: 150
Joined: 22 Feb 2021 0:44

Re: The Crankshaft lock design

Postby GWiens2001 » 24 Sep 2021 22:01

If I could get STL files, I could 3D print the parts and test it out. I also know some machinists whom I can see if they would help with making a prototype model, if you like.

Because it is your design, I will not try to create my own STL files. I value the work of those who create and engineer things, and do not support just taking their ideas.

Gordon
Just when you finally think you have learned it all, that is when you learn that you don't know anything yet.
User avatar
GWiens2001
Site Admin
 
Posts: 7550
Joined: 3 Sep 2012 16:24
Location: Arizona, United States

Re: The Crankshaft lock design

Postby Yehonatan Knoll » 25 Sep 2021 14:16

Much appreciated, GWiens2001.
But my invitation to collaborate pertains to actual prototypes in terms of dimensions and materials. The tolerances in the cad model assume certain production methods. Simply printing the parts (from metal?) would not work.
Yehonatan Knoll
 
Posts: 15
Joined: 28 Aug 2019 5:43

Re: The Crankshaft lock design

Postby GWiens2001 » 25 Sep 2021 20:31

I have some friends who own a business that designs and manufactures parts for several industries with 5 axis CNC machines. They can do very exact tolerances, but I do not know their workload at this time.

Gordon
Just when you finally think you have learned it all, that is when you learn that you don't know anything yet.
User avatar
GWiens2001
Site Admin
 
Posts: 7550
Joined: 3 Sep 2012 16:24
Location: Arizona, United States

Re: The Crankshaft lock design

Postby prevariikation » 26 Sep 2021 13:57

So I've been working out the recursion for distinct bittings, but I seem to be undercounting bittings somehow. If someone could set me right, I'd appreciate the insight.

It seems like the MAC in this system is 1. If Bm(n) is the number of keys of length n that end with a cut of m (cuts considered to be {1,2,3,4},) then I think the recursive properties satisfied would be
B1(n) = B1(n - 1) + B2(n - 1)
B2(n) = B1(n - 1) + B2(n - 1) + B3(n - 1)
B3(n) = B2(n - 1) + B3(n - 1) + B4(n - 1)
B4(n) = B3(n - 1) + B4(n - 1)

aka, a key with an ending cut of 3 could only have a previous cut of 2, 3, or 4.

Since there are exactly four ways to start a key, I populated this chart. (Turns out there's an expression of the total number of keys as a function of the Fibonacci sequence, where Fm = mth number in Fibonacci sequence, given F0 = 0 and F1 = 1.)

Code: Select all
# of wafers, | # of keys with a    | Total distinct keys with
     n       | last bitting of     | n wafers (= 2 * F_[2n+1])
             |    1    2    3    4 |
-------------+---------------------+--------------------------
           1 |    1    1    1    1 |     4 = 2 * 2
           2 |    2    3    3    2 |    10 = 2 * 5
           3 |    5    8    8    5 |    26 = 2 * 13
           4 |   13   21   21   13 |    68 = 2 * 34
           5 |   34   55   55   34 |   178 = 2 * 89
           6 |   89  144  144   89 |   466 = 2 * 233
           7 |  233  377  377  233 |  1220 = 2 * 610
           8 |  610  987  987  610 |  3194 = 2 * 1597
           9 | 1597 2584 2584 1597 |  8362 = 2 * 4181
          10 | 4181 6765 6765 4181 | 21892 = 2 * 10946

So I'm undercounting keys somehow, since I end up with 3194 for an 8-wafer system, instead of the 3482 in the provisional patent. I've calculated that the key counts in the patent numerically match the same recursive properties, but there's something I'm overlooking :?
she/her/hers
User avatar
prevariikation
 
Posts: 150
Joined: 22 Feb 2021 0:44

Re: The Crankshaft lock design

Postby Yehonatan Knoll » 26 Sep 2021 14:32

Nice job:) And I didn't realize the Fibonacci connection!

I must have made a mistake. Just calculated the recursion (simplified by the symmetries) manually.
Yehonatan Knoll
 
Posts: 15
Joined: 28 Aug 2019 5:43

Re: The Crankshaft lock design

Postby prevariikation » 26 Sep 2021 17:33

Oh, I feel that! I did the addition manually at first and had to redo seven rows :lol: Cool, at least I wasn't neglecting something obvious. The closed formula using Fibonacci numbers was a nice surprise.
she/her/hers
User avatar
prevariikation
 
Posts: 150
Joined: 22 Feb 2021 0:44

Re: The Crankshaft lock design

Postby prevariikation » 29 Nov 2021 19:04

Would you be comfortable sharing dimensions for some of the lock parts? I tried to model the bittings using hand-measurements from the PDF, but I'm now trying to use that model to identify bittings which can't be picked with straight tools.

Taking the "Euro-profile" idea seriously, I cross-referenced the PDF housing length with the length of my euro cylinder, and ended up with a wafer thickness of ~0.068". But now I see the probe in fig. 10 was assigned a width of 0.5mm, which would put the wafer thickness closer to ~0.045". I guess I also assumed the distance between cuts is the same as the wafer thickness, I'm guessing that's not right either?
she/her/hers
User avatar
prevariikation
 
Posts: 150
Joined: 22 Feb 2021 0:44

Re: The Crankshaft lock design

Postby Yehonatan Knoll » 30 Nov 2021 6:01

The current design only matches Eurocylinder in diameter (length is not an issue...).
Wafer width=1.3 mm (key segments=1.13 each).

My intuition is that the percentage of key bittings not preventing a straight tool insertion is too small to be practically exploited as a weakness (one can also simply discard them).

I can send you some solid file if you wish.
Yehonatan Knoll
 
Posts: 15
Joined: 28 Aug 2019 5:43

Re: The Crankshaft lock design

Postby prevariikation » 30 Nov 2021 8:20

I would appreciate that :) my email address is prevarikation@gmail, if that's easiest.

Thank you for the clarifications, I'll try to update the visualizer today. The current model suggests that, for 10 wafers, ~75% of the keyspace is theoretically pickable front-to-back using a thin allen wrench. (The long end would be held horizontally, shaft near the bottom of the keyway, and twisted to turn the tip of the shorter end to manipulate wafers.)

As you said, even just excluding bittings still leaves >2000 with substantial pick resistance, so none of this is meant as an affront to the design! I was just wondered what a "city rake" kit would statistically be for this lock.
she/her/hers
User avatar
prevariikation
 
Posts: 150
Joined: 22 Feb 2021 0:44

Re: The Crankshaft lock design

Postby Yehonatan Knoll » 30 Nov 2021 15:27

75% is a lot! Yet another lesson why not to trust your intuition when it comes to nontrivial combinatorics...
Would be interesting to see how this percentage changes with the number of wafers. It clearly vanishes asymptotically.
Yehonatan Knoll
 
Posts: 15
Joined: 28 Aug 2019 5:43

Re: The Crankshaft lock design

Postby Yehonatan Knoll » 30 Nov 2021 15:36

To be clear - did you define "pickable combination" as one which does not have *both* maximal right and maximal left gates? If so then 75% still looks much too high...
Yehonatan Knoll
 
Posts: 15
Joined: 28 Aug 2019 5:43

Re: The Crankshaft lock design

Postby prevariikation » 30 Nov 2021 16:15

I apologize, I made multiple mistakes and inverted the results of the 8-wafer case :oops: With the updated sizing data and a thin hex wrench of thickness 1.27mm = 0.050", it's returning:

  • 8 wafers: 1696 of 3194 (≈53%) total bittings prevent straight tool manipulation
  • 10 wafers: 15834 of 21892 (≈72.3%)
"Pickable" combinations include any bittings without a maximal right and left gate, but I also tried to account for those that would allow a tool to reach at an angle. In the code, we attempt to measure if there's a path for a straight tool from the opening to the back of the rearmost wafer in rest position.

Paths are checked from -45 to 45 degrees, in 5 degree increments. The algorithm is based on a check for a vertical rod: we identify the potential contact points (the interior corners of the wafers,) and see if the rightmost left-hand contact point and leftmost right-hand contact point are separated by at least the width of the rod, meaning that there is a clear path through. Then we simulate rotation of the rod by instead rotating the contact points by the given angles. I'll try to put up a drawing, it's not a complicated idea but I don't know if it's explained/coded well.
she/her/hers
User avatar
prevariikation
 
Posts: 150
Joined: 22 Feb 2021 0:44

PreviousNext

Return to Locks

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 9 guests