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Diameter of bitted keys - WAS Mortice Keys

Information about locks themselves. Questions, tips and lock diagram information should be posted here.

Diameter of bitted keys - WAS Mortice Keys

Postby Engineer » 25 Aug 2008 16:25

I thought I'd post this, incase it is of some use to someone; someday?

I've got the sizes finally, the diameters are the same as SWG (Standard Wire Guage), except for the half-sizes. These are not in the SWG specification that I can find, but they proved to be exactly half-way between the two sizes anyway.

Notice how close the sizes are to each other? It's hundredths of an inch. Almost no chance of telling the difference without a guage or micrometer. In an "emergency" where you do not have a guage or micrometer, you could try putting them end-to-end and running your fingernail over them. This would give you your best chance of feeling any difference in diameter as you move from one key to the other.

If you are using a micrometer to determine an unknown key, I found on my stock, that the keys measure 1-3 hundredths of an inch smaller than their rated diameter. (sorry for all the underscores, but if I don't put them in, all the formatting is removed on posting and you get a jumble of numbers).

Gauge__Inch___mm

__1____0.3000__7.620
_1.5___0.2880__7.315
__2 ___0.2760__7.010
_2.5___0.2640__6.706
__3 ___0.2520__6.401
_3.5___0.2420__6.149
__4___0.2320__5.893
_4.5__0.2220__5.639
__5___0.2120__5.385
_5.5__0.2020__5.131
__6___0.1920__4.877
_6.5__0.1840__4.674
__7___0.1760__4.470
_7.5__0.1680__4.267
__8___0.1600__4.064
_8.5__0.1520__3.861
__9___0.1440__3.658
_9.5__0.1360__3.454
_10___0.1280__3.251
_10.5_0.1220__3.099
_11___0.1160__2.946
_11.5_0.1100__2.794
_12___0.1040__2.642
_12.5_0.0980__2.489
Engineer
 
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Joined: 21 Aug 2008 14:53
Location: UK

Postby Jaakko » 25 Aug 2008 23:14

You can get the numbers in the order you want by using the code tags.

Someone could tell me why would someone want to measure diameter with gauge numbers and not just tell the diameter?
Image
Jaakko
 
Posts: 1967
Joined: 19 Feb 2006 4:23
Location: Finland (Pirkkala)

Postby Legacy712 » 26 Aug 2008 3:43

Easier to remember and write #5 or #8 than 0.2120 or 0.1600 (5.385 or 4.064 metric).

Standardization, maybe? Or maybe just an old carry-over?

The numbers of wire were in common use earlier than 1735. It is believed that they originally were based on the series of drawn wires, No. 1 being the original rod, and succeeding numbers corresponding with each draw, so that No. 10, for example, would have passed ten times through the draw plate. Later, more standardized dimensions were developed.
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Joined: 3 Aug 2008 3:01
Location: The Windy City

Postby Engineer » 26 Aug 2008 8:52

Thank you very much for telling me about the code tags. I've not used them beofre, so will practise thanks!

The reason for using gauges ("gages" is an alternate spelling, more common in the US) is just as said, it is a carry-over from the days when the keys were made from standard "wire" (the thicker wire is more like a rod, but it's still called wire to an engineer ;) Everyone has their own terminology for their own field and sometimes it gets confusing!

The bitted part was just welded on, originally in a forge and was skilled work alright. Especially as the lock was made in hand as well and the key was usually modified to fit the lock. I have keys 200-300 years old and they are so ornate. They look wonderful, but I cannot help seeing them as an engineer and marvelling at how you cut a shape like that out of a steel that is more like cast iron (VERY hard and brittle) - and thick! Not only that, but you have to make a similar "negative" for inside the lock to act as ward.

Sadly I don't have any of the locks, they seem to fair very badly from the weather over so many years, so only the keys seem to make it sadly.

Gives me a whole new respect for what could be done with those old tools and something I always mean to try for myself sometime, using the sorts of tools they would have had.

The other reason is it was an early attempt at standardising, if you know the diameter of the barrel of the key very precisely, you know enough of the sizes that need to be made inside the lock, to ease things a little. You can also use your standard-sized drills. After all, changing the size of the wire is easier than making a new special-sized drill.

Thanks for all the replies, it has really helped me thanks.
Engineer
 
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Joined: 21 Aug 2008 14:53
Location: UK

Postby Engineer » 26 Aug 2008 11:34

I just found this:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... :IT&ih=019

http://tinyurl.com/5mv7ve

Which is another reason for knowing about gauges. Some manufacturers (and so suppliers) supply "general" bitted keys only by gauge. You can save a lot fo money if you know which keys can be replaced by "generic" bitted ones. It can also reduce the amount of stock you have to carry and so costs in two ways.
Engineer
 
Posts: 584
Joined: 21 Aug 2008 14:53
Location: UK

Postby lockpicker69 » 26 Aug 2008 11:51

http://216.239.59.104/search?q=cache:wb ... cd=1&gl=uk

good post engineer,have a look at the above i am sure you will like it
lockpicker69
 
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Joined: 7 Jun 2007 11:29
Location: england

Postby Engineer » 26 Aug 2008 13:59

lockpicker69 wrote:http://216.239.59.104/search?q=cache:wbpRZwurCwgJ:www.lockcollectors.eu/association/lockcollector_sample.pdf+the+lock+collector&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=uk

good post engineer,have a look at the above i am sure you will like it


Excelent Lockpicker69!!!

This is EXACTLY the sort of thing I mean - Look at the bottom of page 5 to see the intricate circular ward that needs to be made for inside the lock. You try making that with a pair of scissors and a beer can!

Now timagine making it with a hard, brittle too-high a carbon steel with only basic handtools you've probably had to make yourself? These guys truly were master craftsmen...
Engineer
 
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Joined: 21 Aug 2008 14:53
Location: UK


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