Vistawall locks?

by **PaleHorse** » 16 Sep 2008 22:22

I see these blooming things everywhere, I think every business in town uses them. I've tried SPP and using the snap pick guns with no luck. I can get the cylinder to rotate, but after about half a turn it just requires more torque than my tension wrenches can take. Would this be some kind of security feature, having extra tough springs to avoid picking?

by **PaleHorse** » 16 Sep 2008 22:57

Please note, I'm not asking for advice on how to open them. I just want to know if I'm thinking in the right direction on this.

by **ToolyMcgee** » 16 Sep 2008 23:26

So, you are picking the lock on the shop, huh? Tisk tisk. :wink:

I can't turn up anything about the internal mechanism in 5 mins of searching, but if I had to say, then security pins. Probably spools if it is turning "halfway". Usually lock manufacturor's like their locks to open when you turn the key, so if you feel like the plug is turning, but you are applying more than adequate turning force without opening the lock you are probably encountering a security driver pin giving you a false set.

How much "half turn" are you talking about? 20 degrees or less?

by **PaleHorse** » 16 Sep 2008 23:32

Yes, it's at the shop, but I've got permission. I mean a whole half turn, 180 degrees. These things have a knob on the inside that's a bear to turn from the other side too, you can feel the resistance build up and then release as the hook shaped latch is popped out into the door facing.

by **PaleHorse** » 16 Sep 2008 23:37

Eureka! Apparently Vistawall is the manufacturer of the entire door and entrance.

Really, this is getting farther in than I care to go. Anyone who can afford these things can afford to call a locksmith to open it if they need to, and seeing how they're mainly used by businesses, I think it'd be best to let the topic drop.

by **ToolyMcgee** » 17 Sep 2008 0:10

Yes, this is how I figured out it was on your shop, but the casual searching of the vendors sites I find didn't yield any info on the locks they use.

I don't see the problem talking about opening methods for this lock. Lots of businesses in my area have BEST and Schlage comercial locks on their doors and they are open forum discussion. Medeco is even open discussion.

I think if you are turning it 180, then have you considered you might not be turning the right direction? I know it sounds stupid, but trouble shooting 101 is eliminate the obvious. How far do you have to turn the key? If it is the right direction and you usually have to turn a full 360 then it could be you need more turning force, or it could be that the driver pins are popping back into the bottom of the keyway and you need to use the back of your pick to push them all out to continue. The lock is designed to have a key in it when it turns after all. Sounds like that is the potential problem.

by **keysman** » 17 Sep 2008 0:27

ToolyMcgee wrote: or it could be that the driver pins are popping back into the bottom of the keyway and you need to use the back of your pick to push them all out to continue.

That would be my first guess.

by **globallockytoo** » 17 Sep 2008 2:26

Vistawall locks on aluminum doors sometimes require more pressure to turn the plug fully because often the bolt is binding on the strike or hole in frame where bolt locates.

If you release this pressure, either by pushing or pulling the door, while turning the wrench.....or lifting the door slightly, you could have more success.

by **raimundo** » 17 Sep 2008 7:05

Once the lock is picked, don't ruin the tensor turning it, use a small flat blade screwdriver to turn the plug. if it stops at 180 degrees, the first thing you should think of is the top pins dropping into the bottom of the keyway and check to see if they need to be pushed back. If this does not solve it, then definatley go the other direction, either with a plug spinner or repicking.

by **PaleHorse** » 17 Sep 2008 9:18

I think I found the problem. According to the boss, that lock hasn't had a key in it since they intalled it 13 years ago, and it's on an exterior door. :oops:

by **globallockytoo** » 17 Sep 2008 10:05

PaleHorse wrote:I think I found the problem. According to the boss, that lock hasn't had a key in it since they intalled it 13 years ago, and it's on an exterior door.

In your original post you said you "can get the cylinder to rotate".

Dis you mean that the plug (barrel) wont turn, effectively meaning you didnt pick it?

If the cylinder will rotate 180 degrees but the plug wont turn.....then the cylinder is jamming on the retaining screw.

But even a door that is 13 years old should still allow the key to operate the cylinder.

In almost all cases you should first lubricate the cylinder prior to picking with graphite or teflon.

by **Steven.Williams** » 17 Sep 2008 12:34

i have a vistawall cylinder and i had that problem when i first started to pick it, once i would get it to turn and it would stop i would get a second tension wrench and stick it in the lock where the bottom of the key would go, and it would finish the turn, i dont know if some of the pins fall and block the plug from turning but this is how i did it and it seems to work for me.

by **PaleHorse** » 17 Sep 2008 20:04

I did manage to pick the pins, the cylinder would rotate to a certain point then stop, and I could feel back pressure as if from a spring.

by **straightpick** » 17 Sep 2008 21:14

Vistawall manufactures aluminum doors and storefronts. The cylinders coudn be anything the customer requested. In not specified, they are usually Yale 8 keyways or Schlage C keyways.

by **PaleHorse** » 17 Sep 2008 21:36

Would a picture help? I can get one tomorrow.

Vistawall locks?

Vistawall locks?

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