Schlage and Security Pins

by **something_clever** » 29 Sep 2009 13:41

I just got my first locks and picks to start practicing on and the one quikset I got was open pretty much by the time I could get my pick all the way in it. Every time. I also have a no-name lock with a Schlage keyway that seems to be a Schlage ripoff of some sort. I can pick this one too with relative ease. My problem is with the five Schlage cylinders I have. One of them I rekeyed and my fiance and I went through DB's picking exercise, we got to the fourth pin (I had to steal some springs from the kwikset though because I ruined a few... Don't ask). Now we can't get it open. I also had a few of the kwikset pins in there just so there was more variation in length. I don't know if it's the springs or the pins or just lack of practice on this one.

The main problem is with the other four Schlages. We just can't seem to get any single one of them open. I'm assuming that it's either that we're overlifting a pin on each of them, or there are security pins involved.

What are the chances of random old Schlage cylinders having security pins in them? I don't see model numbers or any identifying marks other than brand name on them so I really can't just look them up and see. I did notice that in the security pins sticky thread that there was only one Schlage listed. Does that mean that they usually don't have them?

Thanks guys,
SC

by **something_clever** » 29 Sep 2009 13:53

Ok, sorry searched a little more and found this;

"The Schlage residential deadbolt uses spool pins as well" and
"The Schlage is a better lock, and comes with security pins if you are ready for that."

But I don't know what these came from... Plus, two of them look really old. So it doesn't help that much. The one I took apart did not have any spools, all five top pins were regular ones.

by **thelockpickkid** » 29 Sep 2009 15:43

I am assuming you have 5 pin cores, or the SC1 keyway right? I have some of these that are new, that have no security pins, I have also bought some old ones to play with and they don't have any security pins either, most new cores I would say come factory with security pins, spools, but just because the packaging says so, some of them don't. The tolerances are really good in the majority of these locks and some can be harder to pick than others, the high low high pin combination makes for an even greater challenge at times.

by **something_clever** » 29 Sep 2009 16:10

Thanks lockpickkid,

That would explain it then. Especially since on the four pin practice one I put low high low high... Guess I shouldn't have tried to challenge myself that much so soon... Now if I could just get it open to repin it...

Oh, and I believe they are the SC1 keyway. I know I've seen the same keyway many times and can picture the key, but I don't have one available to check the numbers on. Definitely 5 pin though. Guess it just means I need alot more practice on these ones.

by **thelockpickkid** » 29 Sep 2009 16:49

ok, I don't know what core you have, but you could take the bible cover off, the slide or snap that holds the springs and top pins in place, just dump everything out and repin and re cover, or you could use a shim and a pick to shim the lock open from the back, to open the lock to pull the core. Any more questions just ask. Also I might add that if you use other springs in these locks sometimes, you may have difficulties, used springs are slightly compressed and will give you hell when you go to pick the lock again with them re-installed, or from another lock. Just the nature of it all. The high low high is great pinning for practice but not when just starting out, or slightly inexperienced, work your way up to this!

by **something_clever** » 29 Sep 2009 17:34

The only one of the Schlages that I have been able to rekey was done by taking the bible cover off. But it was a major PITA and I could barely get it back on. That one was crimped in. There's three that have two dimples in them... I tried to use a punch and drive them out (I thought maybe they would slide out) but no go. I'm not really sure how I would go about re-attaching those anyway. The other one was folded over the top with relatively thick brass... I don't think I want to mess with that one. If you know how to take the bible cover of the ones with the two dimples that would be great. If you're not sure what I mean I could take some pictures when my fiance gets home with her camera in a few hours.

by **thelockpickkid** » 29 Sep 2009 17:39

something_clever wrote:The only one of the Schlages that I have been able to rekey was done by taking the bible cover off. But it was a major PITA and I could barely get it back on. That one was crimped in. There's three that have two dimples in them... I tried to use a punch and drive them out (I thought maybe they would slide out) but no go. I'm not really sure how I would go about re-attaching those anyway. The other one was folded over the top with relatively thick brass... I don't think I want to mess with that one. If you know how to take the bible cover of the ones with the two dimples that would be great. If you're not sure what I mean I could take some pictures when my fiance gets home with her camera in a few hours.

I think those slide off, you have to be careful though not to damage it, because if you do, you have to get a replacement in order for your lock to work. I know!! I have ruined tons of them, but I have replacement parts! Take some shim stock and push it through the back while rapping the lock on solid wood just gently push the shim through, or use the flat part of a pick. when the shim is pushed through, turn the lock to open and follow the plug out with a follower.

by **something_clever** » 29 Sep 2009 17:42

Oh yeah, and I haven't had any luck shimming although all I have to work with is beer cans. It's a pretty tight fit but I've gotten the back pin shimmed but after that I can't seem to get it without bending the can to s*&# or tearing it.

Oops, you beat me to it... What do you think would work in the absence of actual shim stock besides a can? I'll try again on the bible cover though.

by **something_clever** » 29 Sep 2009 18:22

Well no luck with either for now... I'll probably try later to take the bible cover off of the practice one again. Hopefully I can get it back on again without wrecking it. It was pretty hard the first time. For now I think I should take a break and collect some more shim material. Of course that's just an excuse to drink a beer, but so what...

by **ToolyMcgee** » 29 Sep 2009 19:31

There is a drafting stencil that makes good shim stock...
http://www.lockpicking101.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=37071&start=0
60 cents for 1 or 2 at a hobby store.

by **something_clever** » 29 Sep 2009 19:50

Thanks, that's a good idea. I read the thread you linked though and one guy said he used the foil type peel-off freshness seal (or whatever they're called), and I get those all the time on my cans of rolling tobacco. I should start using those until I get some shims. Too bad I always throw them away, or I'd have a million of them. I did end up getting lucky and not ruining the bible cover on the one I was using for Digital_blue's exercise though and rekeyed it so that it should be easier. I haven't had any luck yet but I've only tried once or twice because my hands are hurting pretty bad from playing with this stuff all day. Plus my concentration isn't as good now that I'm drinking.

by **something_clever** » 29 Sep 2009 20:49

woohoo... I got one shimmed... Now I can have a couple to practice on. I tried the foil stuff from a can of tobacco (found one while looking for something else), but it didn't work too well, I could still only get to one pin before it started to fold and rip... But I found one of those little security stickers like on a cd and those work great. I thought they would be too thin and weak since the other stuff wasn't holding up but the only reason they weren't working was because they were to thick and wouldn't slide in any farther... At least that's my theory.

Thanks, LPK.

by **thelockpickkid** » 29 Sep 2009 23:11

I was going to say the security stickers, you can always find one of them around the house, but you beat me to it!!!

by **something_clever** » 29 Sep 2009 23:35

Yeah, I had read that the other day but I could've sworn there wasn't a single one in the house... But I actually checked all the cds and dvds earlier and still couldn't find one... Then I randomly saw one on a package from a waterpick showerhead from walmart that I bought like a year ago and kept the package because it has a lifetime warranty... Cut it open and 10 minutes later had shimmed my first lock.

by **JACKthePICKER** » 27 Oct 2009 20:03

i remember seeing a schlage pad lock and the guy said it had all security pins

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