Beefing up Kwikset 660 Series Deadbolt

[Klaiviel]

Okay, so since I have become involved in this hobby I have gained a whole new perspective on the inadequacy of most common locks. Unfortunately this has allowed me to pay more attention to the locks everyone uses on their door and I have noticed that a few of my relatives use this cheap $12 lock. This concerns me as I consider this lock the easiest to pick in my collection and I can consistently open it in less than 15 seconds. Anyways so my relatives are aware of my new hobby and I approached them about this and they are not quite as security minded as myself to say the least. However, they did say that if I could upgrade their existing lock without any cosmetic changes or key changes they would be okay with that. So finally I get to the point, is it possible to upgrade a cheap Kwikset 660 deadbolt?

So far I have toyed with the idea of changing out all the driver pins for spool pins, which should be possible, however I have noticed that the Kwikset spool pins available online are .160" tall as opposed to the regular .180" tall of a normal driver pin. Is that .020" gap going to make any difference that would hinder normal operation as far as the spring's force is concerned? I don't think that it would and at this point I see this as probably the most viable option.

The thing is though that I can pick 5 spool pins, so I was wondering if its possible to take this even further for the extra peace of mind, perhaps filing my own serrations or something to that effect. Or if there is a different higher security cylinder that accepts a KW1 key blank I could pin it accordingly to work with the old key perhaps. If you guys have any ideas they would be much appreciated, thanks.

[Schuyler]

Not every chamber. Keep the first chamber either standard or serrated. Just think of the amount of slop you'll have if they are all spool. It'll wear on the lock a ton.

Also - it's not just the lock. You need to take a serious view of their security as a whole picture, then determine if their lock is worth bothering with at all. I know it can feel great to contribute to your family's security, but as they stated they want no cosmetic or key changes I have to think they're overall security is probably pretty low.

I have seen homes who use old kwiksets on the front door, which had glass panes in it & a defiant on the back door to the porch. The windows of the 2nd floor all folded in on themselves from the outside and there were tall ladders available on the property. There was a simple latch that could be slipped with a twig or pencil to let you into the back of the garage and from their you could access the attic and drop in from there.

The place is a sieve. The locks on their doors existed to keep the honest honest and to prevent crimes of curiosity and opportunity.

So - try to take as plain and rational a view of their security as you can and figure out exactly what their locks are doing for them.

I'm not saying that you shouldn't try to shore up security gaps where you can, but really, make sure you're approaching the situation rationally, otherwise you're just going to end up, someday, with an abloy on their front door and a window that's never latched right next to it. You know?

[Klaiviel]

Abloy on their door? The Abloy is going on my door. =P In all seriousness I know what you mean as far as the whole picture, believe me, my house is a fortress. The fact of the matter is no matter how much I would like to fix their particular sieve; I can only do what they give me permission to do and at this point that looks like internal modifications to the lock and a pair of 3" screws in the door jamb to replace the mystery screws that are in there now. Good advice about keeping one pin non-spool, I did not think about how 5 would make the lock sloppy. I realize its probably futile as yes they do have windows in some of their doors >.< however when its only costing me $5 for 100 spools and it will take no more than 5 minutes of my time to do, why not? Every little bit counts right? Even if I do go above and beyond its not that big of a deal because I enjoy this kind of stuff. With that in mind, any more thoughts on ways we could take this beyond spools? I wonder if it would be possible to transfer the internals of the SmartKey to the trim of their lock although I don't know if that would increase or decrease the security; it would be nice to have the bump protections the SmartKey offers but with such an easy destructive bypass out their and with most burglaries occurring by forced entry I wonder if the internals in their now would stand up better to destructive bypass?

[globallockytoo]

all new kwikset locks use the smartkey cylinders, which are significantly harder for average joe to pick or bypass. Buy the exact same model and color new, get their existing key and program the lock to it.

Might cost $40.

[Klaiviel]

all new kwikset locks use the smartkey cylinders, which are significantly harder for average joe to pick or bypass. Buy the exact same model and color new, get their existing key and program the lock to it.

Might cost $40.

That's one way to do it, I have to disagree with you about all new Kwikset locks using the Smartkey cylinders though. I have a Kwikset 660 deadbolt myself that I purchased as a practice lock not two weeks ago, new, at True Value Hardware Store. I can tell you 100% for sure it is not using the Smartkey cylinder; so far for my fiance, brother, and grandma have all picked it with little effort. =P

[Schuyler]

Re: my initial statement/your response - I agree with you, and just wanted to make sure you weren't hoping to see a modified lock as the panacea to their security woes.

That's one way to do it, I have to disagree with you about all new Kwikset locks using the Smartkey cylinders though. I have a Kwikset 660 deadbolt myself that I purchased as a practice lock not two weeks ago, new, at True Value Hardware Store. I can tell you 100% for sure it is not using the Smartkey cylinder; so far for my fiance, brother, and grandma have all picked it with little effort. =P

There is a lot of stock still out there, yes, and most smaller hardware stores (including True Values) still have a good amount of old pin tumbler models. However, Home Depot, Lowes, Canadian Tire (it'll be called Wieser up there), will have 3rd gen smartkeys all over the shelves. And Global's got it - you can get the same trim and as soon as you get it installed you can program their old key to it.

And yes, it will be an increase in security. It's situations like this, exactly, that makes the lock good. It's not a high security product, but it is absurdly better than what they used to have and the lock on the shelf next to it. There are attacks against it, but none of them as quick and easy as bumping, to be sure, and picking them is miserable because all of those little sliders have serrations.

[Klaiviel]

Re: my initial statement/your response - I agree with you, and just wanted to make sure you weren't hoping to see a modified lock as the panacea to their security woes.

That's one way to do it, I have to disagree with you about all new Kwikset locks using the Smartkey cylinders though. I have a Kwikset 660 deadbolt myself that I purchased as a practice lock not two weeks ago, new, at True Value Hardware Store. I can tell you 100% for sure it is not using the Smartkey cylinder; so far for my fiance, brother, and grandma have all picked it with little effort. =P

There is a lot of stock still out there, yes, and most smaller hardware stores (including True Values) still have a good amount of old pin tumbler models. However, Home Depot, Lowes, Canadian Tire (it'll be called Wieser up there), will have 3rd gen smartkeys all over the shelves. And Global's got it - you can get the same trim and as soon as you get it installed you can program their old key to it.

And yes, it will be an increase in security. It's situations like this, exactly, that makes the lock good. It's not a high security product, but it is absurdly better than what they used to have and the lock on the shelf next to it. There are attacks against it, but none of them as quick and easy as bumping, to be sure, and picking them is miserable because all of those little sliders have serrations.

Cool, I think that's probably the route I will go then, thanks.

[globallockytoo]

Thanks Schuyler. You made my point for me. Many of the retailers will still be selling old stock (which is natural - to clear back inventory), but if you ask deliberately, they will sell new style product.

It is definitely the cheaper best option, when trying to maintain the identical ambience of the current hardware.

It is necessary to consider that, in truth, many of the new style products (developed in the last 2 years or so) will probably not have found their way to market (everywhere - yet).

There are better options, of course, but when faced with customers who want to maintain the existing product (or look) and keying, I will often recommend the better quality brands, but order cylinders that can be keyed to their existing keys.

There are a few manufacturers that will make kwikset profile keyways that will retrofit into other brands of hardware. (GMS is one). But, the smartkey system is proprietary to Kwikset.

If a manufacturer decided to produce interchangeable cylinders (under license from Kwikset) there would probably be significantly increased opportunities to sell the product to users of other brands of hardware.

Schlage's new Securekey product is currently being sued by Kwikset for patent infringement. A case that could drag on, perhaps.

I am receiving upwards of 3-5 inquiries a week, from searchers looking for the new securekey by Schlage, but it is tough to find any retailers (right now).
It might be a marketing opportunity, for Kwikset to start producing the smartkey product in an SC1 profile.... that would certainly enable Schlage product users to benefit from the keying alike opportunities. ( I dont think that SC1 or KW1 are protected by design registrations or patents (any longer).

[Rickthepick]

Theres no need to go mental on home security.

If you have an abloy on your door and lock yourself out, how do you plan on getting in?

Keep it above criminal chancer skill but below your own

[globallockytoo]

Theres no need to go mental on home security.

If you have an abloy on your door and lock yourself out, how do you plan on getting in?

Keep it above criminal chancer skill but below your own

Interesting statement!

I recommend to many clients to get locks that require you to lock the door from outside, to avoid being locked out. (if you lose the key - that's different)

[pjzstones]

Theres no need to go mental on home security.

If you have an abloy on your door and lock yourself out, how do you plan on getting in?

Keep it above criminal chancer skill but below your own

Interesting statement!

I recommend to many clients to get locks that require you to lock the door from outside, to avoid being locked out. (if you lose the key - that's different)

what's a lockie do in these situations? de? sorry to go off topic i've just been think about that recently.

[Klaiviel]

Theres no need to go mental on home security.

If you have an abloy on your door and lock yourself out, how do you plan on getting in?

Keep it above criminal chancer skill but below your own

I understand your point but I disagree with it; I prefer to go mental on home security. I am a very ritualistic person and I always put my keys in the same spot when I get home and I always take them when I leave, I have never forgotten them in my life, that's not to say it could never happen to me, I am sure it could, its just extremely unlikely. In the event that I would need to get in without the key, DE would be the only option and even that would be hard.

I can understand from a normal person's point of view that this may seem excessive; however, I look at it like this. If I am in my house and someone enters without my permission they are going to become acquainted with my Remington 870 MCS Marine Magnum and that is a situation I don't ever want to find myself in, therefore I will give the prospective burglar every reasonable deterrence I can think of and if he still wants in after all that then I will stand my ground. Again I can understand how some would see this as excessive, but I have to worry about so many things throughout the day the one place I don't want to have to worry about security is my home, know what I mean?

[lockman0075]

Let me start out by saying "Locks keep honest people, honest". I majority of break ins occurs through windows and doors with windows. Also, "Beefing up" a Kwikset is an oxymoron. The locks are what I call sloppy. Have alot of tolerance between the plug and the cylinder. Spool pins and serrated pins simply don't work in them very well.

I commend you on wanting to learn more about the trade and rekeying locks but there isn't really a way to make it "pick proof". All a person needs is a dent puller and a #2 philips screwdriver. Better yet a drill and #2 philips screwdriver.

Spend a little money and go with Schlage Primus. If you want to go full bore go with Medeco.

[globallockytoo]

Spend a little money and go with Schlage Primus. If you want to go full bore go with Medeco.

Or better yet, avoid those two products due to the overblown rediculous prices they charge for them and the fact that neither are pick or bump proof and with Medeco, you can duplicate the keys on any plastic card (like a credit card). Great security for a $250 deadbolt.

I would definitely recommend Abloy or Bilock as the two most secure options of keyways available in the US market.

I wouldnt touch Medeco with a 10' barge pole.

[Josh K]

Spend a little money and go with Schlage Primus. If you want to go full bore go with Medeco.

Or better yet, avoid those two products due to the overblown rediculous prices they charge for them and the fact that neither are pick or bump proof and with Medeco, you can duplicate the keys on any plastic card (like a credit card). Great security for a $250 deadbolt.

I would definitely recommend Abloy or Bilock as the two most secure options of keyways available in the US market.

I wouldnt touch Medeco with a 10' barge pole.

+1. Though you still pay a premium for both Abloy and Bilock.