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binding pins and order of picking

Having read the FAQ's you are still unfulfilled and seek more enlightenment, so post your general lock picking questions here.
Forum rules
Do not post safe related questions in this sub forum! Post them in This Old Safe

The sub forum you are currently in is for asking Beginner Hobby Lock Picking questions only.

binding pins and order of picking

Postby Dr Sticky » 8 Jun 2007 22:36

I dont understand how the lock decides what should be the binding pin or what order u should pick the pins in.If this is in the faq or somewhere in the stickys im sorry i missed it.
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Postby freakparade3 » 8 Jun 2007 23:06

The holes for the pins are not drilled in a perfectly straight line. This makes the pins not all bind at the same time. The pin that is offset the least will bind first under tenion. The pin that is offset the most will bind last.
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Postby Knowthebird » 8 Jun 2007 23:07

Yah, its in the stickies (I assume :-).

The lock does not really decide the order. The order the pins bind in is determined by how the holes holding the pins are alligned. This is determined by how the holes where drilled into the lock.

The binding pin is the pin in the hole that is farthest to the left or right (depending on which direction tension is applied to the inner cylander). The pin farthest to the left or right is is going to hit the outer shell before any other pins can and bind/get stuck between the inner cylander and the outer cylander.

When the pin is stuck between these two cylanders it becomes more difficult to lift versus the pins not in contact with the outer cylander. This is because there is much more friction on the pin when it is slammed between two cylanders. This also means the more tension you place on the lock the greater the binding pin will press against the two cylanders, friction will increase, and it will be more noticeable that it is the pin that is most difficult to lift.

That tension and friction is enough to hold the binding pin in place as you raise it so lift it above the shear line. When the pin is above the shear line the inner cylander turns some. When it turns the edge of the hole for the first pin prevents it from falling back down. Also, the next pin farthes to the left or right hits the outer cylander and becomes the new binding pin.
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Postby freakparade3 » 8 Jun 2007 23:09

freakparade3 wrote: The pin that is offset the least will bind first under tenion. The pin that is offset the most will bind last.


Sorry, this is the first time i ever quoted my own post. I got this part backward. The pin that is most offset from center will be the first binding pin, not the last.
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Postby Eyes_Only » 8 Jun 2007 23:31

The varying thickness of the pins themselves will also affect the binding order. The thickest pin will most likely bind first depending on how offset the pin chamber is for that given pin stack.

If you have the means, try getting your hands on a couple of identical locks and pin them to the same combination. Then try to pick it. More then likely the binding order of one or two pin stacks of Lock A will bind in a different order than Lock B.
If a lock is a puzzle, then its key is the complete picture
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Postby Dr Sticky » 9 Jun 2007 0:17

The binding pin is the pin in the hole that is farthest to the left or right (depending on which direction tension is applied to the inner cylander). The pin farthest to the left or right is is going to hit the outer shell before any other pins can and bind/get stuck between the inner cylander and the outer cylander.

If im putting tension on the say the right this will change the order of pins binding then putting tension on the left?[/b]
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Postby SemiShady » 9 Jun 2007 1:21

Yes. it should be almost backwords (minus binding due to thickness changes in pins) However only 1 way will unlock the lock. If you have trouble finding the binding pins, try picking it the wrong way and you'll get a different binding order (possible easier) and then you'll have to use a plug spinner to get it spun the right way.
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Postby SemiShady » 9 Jun 2007 1:28

pics from http://deviating.net/lockpicking

this is an exageration but even though the pins are supposed to be in a straight line, they are not because of the mass production techniques and the cost control. A very expencive (or at least very good) lock will be better and the binding pin wont be as obvious. What ever pin hits the wall first.

http://deviating.net/lockpicking/images/02.037-binding_top.gif
http://deviating.net/lockpicking/images/02.036-side_binding.gif


No hotlinked images allowed, img changed to url tags
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Postby Schuyler » 9 Jun 2007 9:32

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Postby Shrub » 9 Jun 2007 9:47

Click on my www button for a pictorial guide of what you should know.
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