Bumping Medeco

[raimundo]

MWtobias is just being cautious, making any sweeping claim about opening locks is just braggadocio. Ive picked a lock or two in my day, but I would not claim to be able to pick all lox, its just a foolish claim,
And the possiblity that he has defective medecos is very unlikely, He is sending the locks to have there integrity confirmed so that it won't just be his word on the subject.

[raimundo]

MWtobias is just being cautious, making any sweeping claim about opening locks is just braggadocio. Ive picked a lock or two in my day, but I would not claim to be able to pick all lox, its just a foolish claim,
And the possiblity that he has defective medecos is very unlikely, He is sending the locks to have there integrity confirmed so that it won't just be his word on the subject.

[cyrus104]

So besides having access to one of almost every keying of the locks how would Mark Tobias be able to claim that his method works on all. Most of the time at least in the computer security field companies do not admit there is a flaw until they absolutely have to. Even with security researcher pressuring them.

Will we just have to trust the people that review him and his work that a certain percent are susceptible?

[cyrus104]

So besides having access to one of almost every keying of the locks how would Mark Tobias be able to claim that his method works on all. Most of the time at least in the computer security field companies do not admit there is a flaw until they absolutely have to. Even with security researcher pressuring them.

Will we just have to trust the people that review him and his work that a certain percent are susceptible?

[globallockytoo]

There is more going on here than just the issue about bumping. Unnamed sources indicate that MWT originally talked to Medeco in Virginia about their findings and offered a contractual agreement (business proposal), that Medeco turned down. Similar contractual agreements have been put together with Schlage and Assa but Medeco refused to enter into an agreement.

The politicking afterwards could just be a MWT attempt to get back at Medeco for turning down the proposal.

(the above information is all hearsay...BTW)

Whatever the motivations....the fact that the vulnerabilities have been made public should be a wake up call to the marketplace to not place so much unfounded trust in companies and their propaganda about their product.

It should also serve as a warning to governments and institutions to take a better look at their security systems to ensure facilities are better protected from covert entry methods, in future.

[dmax999]

There is more going on here than just the issue about bumping. Unnamed sources indicate that MWT originally talked to Medeco in Virginia about their findings and offered a contractual agreement (business proposal), that Medeco turned down. Similar contractual agreements have been put together with Schlage and Assa but Medeco refused to enter into an agreement.

Actually I believe he did mention this at that presentation, I can't remember the exact details. He has some kind of agreement with Medico still, that is how he obtained so many of their top end locks, but they are not required to give him any feedback on his findings. He was not the least bit bitter about them telling him nothing. He also said the M3 was still one of the best locks out there and "bumping" them was not trivial. Even being able to do it, he said it is very tricky and not going to work on evey attempt even on locks they have bumped before.

[Shrub]

Those of us who visit the trade forums know exactally what is thought of marc and his dutch friends and i tend to agree but its not discussion for here,

The thing i will say however is that a common belief is that due to his position he is not challeneged, it is thought to challenege a lawer who does this would be suicide as every loophole and get out clause is known and will be used,

Medecos were beaten long before this in a few ways many of which have never been discussed on this forum even but its only when a big mouth comes into it that people start to hear about it,

In the past ive defended marc and co but soon realised that wasnt the right stance for me personally and i have to admit i agree with whats said on the locksmith foums about him and his mates,

What has or hasnt happened between the manufacturers and him will never be know propely and what is known is likely untrue,

Ive met mark and liked him, we had a good discussion but it doenst mean i have to agree with how things happen,


I think this thread is gogin no-where except circles, we cant tell the members in this section what we know and discuss in the advanced section but that is the only way this thread will be able to continue on its original context, ill leave it alone as it has potential to delve into other aspects of this but as far as how its done etc ive already said it wont happen in here and discussion relating to that should be left for the advanced forums,

[Shrub]

Those of us who visit the trade forums know exactally what is thought of marc and his dutch friends and i tend to agree but its not discussion for here,

The thing i will say however is that a common belief is that due to his position he is not challeneged, it is thought to challenege a lawer who does this would be suicide as every loophole and get out clause is known and will be used,

Medecos were beaten long before this in a few ways many of which have never been discussed on this forum even but its only when a big mouth comes into it that people start to hear about it,

In the past ive defended marc and co but soon realised that wasnt the right stance for me personally and i have to admit i agree with whats said on the locksmith foums about him and his mates,

What has or hasnt happened between the manufacturers and him will never be know propely and what is known is likely untrue,

Ive met mark and liked him, we had a good discussion but it doenst mean i have to agree with how things happen,


I think this thread is gogin no-where except circles, we cant tell the members in this section what we know and discuss in the advanced section but that is the only way this thread will be able to continue on its original context, ill leave it alone as it has potential to delve into other aspects of this but as far as how its done etc ive already said it wont happen in here and discussion relating to that should be left for the advanced forums,

[Shrub]

Those of us who visit the trade forums know exactally what is thought of marc and his dutch friends and i tend to agree but its not discussion for here,

The thing i will say however is that a common belief is that due to his position he is not challeneged, it is thought to challenege a lawer who does this would be suicide as every loophole and get out clause is known and will be used,

Medecos were beaten long before this in a few ways many of which have never been discussed on this forum even but its only when a big mouth comes into it that people start to hear about it,

In the past ive defended marc and co but soon realised that wasnt the right stance for me personally and i have to admit i agree with whats said on the locksmith foums about him and his mates,

What has or hasnt happened between the manufacturers and him will never be know propely and what is known is likely untrue,

Ive met mark and liked him, we had a good discussion but it doenst mean i have to agree with how things happen,


I think this thread is gogin no-where except circles, we cant tell the members in this section what we know and discuss in the advanced section but that is the only way this thread will be able to continue on its original context, ill leave it alone as it has potential to delve into other aspects of this but as far as how its done etc ive already said it wont happen in here and discussion relating to that should be left for the advanced forums,

[CombatWombat]

In the past ive defended marc and co but soon realised that wasnt the right stance for me personally and i have to admit i agree with whats said on the locksmith foums about him and his mates

What do they think about them? good stuff or bad stuff?

[greyman]

Let's not be getting into any libellous discussions about people. Anyone who's in the public eye like MWT or the TOOOLS guys who've appeared on TV are going to stir up various opinions from people inside and outside the trade. None of this has anything to do though with the bumping of sidebar locks.

[MacGyver101]

. . . Anyone who's in the public eye like MWT or the TOOOLS guys who've appeared on TV are going to stir up various opinions from people inside and outside the trade. None of this has anything to do though with the bumping of sidebar locks.

Oddly, though, even MWT has started to really confuse the issue. I'll grant that he was trying to be funny, but one of his latest blog posts is basically:

"Hey look... a monkey broke out of a cage secured with a Master padlock! We told you that anyone could open a Medeco M3 with the right bumpkey!"

Aside from being a rather odd non-sequitor, it's a bit of a cheap shot to be suggesting that a Master padlock is the same as a Medeco M3, or that zoo animals are running around opening Medeco locks. I suspect that's the sort of thing that most people are responding to.

[globallockytoo]

It is common to find Master Pro series padlocks with your choice of cylinder type. Medeco make adaptors specifically for the Master 6621WO Pro series padlock.

For this reason The statement is likely to be a factual statement and not an intended piece of humor, in my opinion.

I can supply a 6621WO Pro today with a Primus, Bilock, Mul-t-lock, or Medeco cylinder quite effortlessly.

[globallockytoo]

Only Bilock will be bump proof!

[UWSDWF]

Only Bilock will be bump proof!

Abloy