Master Key System

[Urbex]

http://www.urbextom.com/personal/master.jpg

This is a small system I designed for the facility where I work, it's based on Schlage. I'm sure by looking at the bitting you can tell the pattern I used. This is the first system I've ever designed, so any tips will be great.

[keysman]

some of your change keys are only 1 cut away from each other.. you need to have at LEAST 2 cuts difference in 2 positions or it is possible the keys will interchange.

[Urbex]

Here is an updated version of the system, using every other number in an attempt to eliminate cross keying.

http://www.urbextom.com/personal/master2.jpg

Thanks keysman!

[MBI]

One other thing to consider: master key charts are usually kept confidential for security reasons and you've now posted this one on the internet, in a not-so-anonymous way.

Now that you've received some feedback on how to do it, you may want to generate a new chart before cutting any keys or repinning any locks.

I enjoy setting up new master key systems. Have fun with it.

[Urbex]

Will do!

[Urbex]

No edit button...

Would a master system be better with more, or less master pins being used?

[Raymond]

Hey, Urbex,

I'll work up an answer in a little while. The less master pins - the better.

[Squelchtone]

Here is an updated version of the system, using every other number in an attempt to eliminate cross keying.

http://www.urbextom.com/personal/master2.jpg

Thanks keysman!

The 55333 bitting seems like it would be very easy to pick. You should at least make it like 55313 if possible, or anything that isnt all the same pin height for master key shear line.

Squelchtone

[keysman]

No edit button...

Would a master system be better with more, or less master pins being used?

It all depends on what you define as " better" .. more master pins will allow you to expand your system to 1000 + changes and also allow for sub-masters.. for example you could set it up so the chief maintaince guy has a key to his office and all related doors , but the AC guy's key can't get in the chiefs office, but goes to every other door.

At the same time more masterpins reduce the securtiy of the system .. the possibility of a " rouge" key working is greatly increased ,as is the pickability

[keysman]

take a look at the schlage site .. lots of GREAT information .. even a Masterkeying 101 class... all free




http://everestprimus.schlage.com/essentials/home.htm

[Urbex]

Picking is no problem at all in an institution like this. The system just needs to be functional, and "seem" secure.

Keysman, thats actually the site how I learned to make the system. I started out inputing the information one key at a time, to writing out the table using nothing but my head as fast as my fingers could type =)

I've learned alot in these past two weeks, the support from the community here is amazing!

[linty]

Hold the boat, you've made some major errors here.

Look at bitting 05 for example (but the problem persists through the whole system). Your bottom is 55333 and your masters are 00022.

Now consider this in terms of shear lines. A lock with 1 master wafer has 2 possible keys that will create a proper shear line. A lock with 2 master wafers has 4 possible keys.

Any of these keys will open lock #5:
55333
55335
55353
55355

This would mean that locks 1, 4, and 5 are all cross-keyed in this system. If you continue down the system there is cross keying everywhere.

It seems that you are deliberately avoiding using cuts that are higher than the master. That will greatly limit your system and it just plain looks weird to me. Also I'm not sure what the "top" column is all about or where you got those numbers.

I would definitely avoid using a rotating constant system if you are new to this and doing it by hand. A progress/hold system will be much easier for you. Watch this.

MK 55333
_________
55111
55115
55117
55119*
55151
55155
55157
55159
55171*
55175*
55177*
55179*
55191*
55195*
55197*
55199*
55511
55515
55517
55519
55551
etc....

Basically what I'm doing here is holding the first two chambers (you could also hold the second two, or the middle three, just have to hold at least 1 chamber. The other chambers are being systematically progressed. I'm avoiding the cuts that match the master key to prevent cross-keying. the cuts with stars beside them are written in for the sake of demonstrating how to create a system, but would likely have to be crossed out as they would probably violate MACS.

Also, it is ALWAYS a good idea to make a system much bigger than the original request to allow room for rekeys or expansion.

[Urbex]

It seems that you are deliberately avoiding using cuts that are higher than the master. That will greatly limit your system and it just plain looks weird to me. Also I'm not sure what the "top" column is all about or where you got those numbers.

It wasn't deliberate, I just used the first bitting I generated for the master. I completely avoid any cuts higher than 3, avoid all MAC problems.

The top column is for the top pins or driver pins, whatever you care to call them.

I'm working on a new version of the system right now, hopefully it will eliminate some more errors.

[Urbex]

http://www.urbextom.com/personal/master3.jpg

Heres the new system, version three.

I hopefully eliminated key interchange!

[bumber]

Now you have to make version 4 because you just re-posted your 'secure' system again

You don't really have to though, but it cant hurt. I mean I dont think any of us are gonna come make keys to your system, but you never know